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Druids...

As our only pure neutral qclass...Druids have a lot to live up to in comparison to Vamp's/Liche's/Sader's so, why are they given so much in the way of penalties? Yes, they are given skills (like another qclass with a drawback) to "help" cover their penalties about location...all well and good...however, I think Druids should either be opened up to a few more races (that might be too much, don't want any power house druid combos) or alter brew where the potions can be shared again yet make them rot death or they can be shared but only by feeding them to group mates (so no worries about people just killing them for their potions like 1.0) ...with one of those little tweaks on brew I think it would open Druid's up a bit more to other players IG for rp/hunting parties JMO (which I am sure the brew idea has been mentioned before)

side thoughts...since Healer, Shaman, and Druid are specialty guilds expected to have members a cut above the more common guilds I think it would be great if you had to quest for Healer and Shaman like you do for Druid. Also should it not be required that Druids have to follow the path of Nature, Healers a path of Life or Faith, and Shamans a path of Death or Discord? "shrug"

Just my 2 cents -

Druids/healers/shamans, were as we all know, originally designed and balanced as playable from the get go, Level 1. Balanced to all the other regular starting classes. And not balanced to equal the "qClasses/races" we had then, or that we have now and have to apply for. Yes, they were tinkered with and balanced out along the way. An eventually made Qclasses, but not due to power/balance issues. More in the vein of a rp/player knowledge kinda way. I don't think they should "live up to in comparrison" to the true Qclasses. And are fine and balanced as they are.

Druids are as we all know "ABSOLUTE FORCES OF EXTREME VIOLENT NATURE" if they choose to be, when prepared, in the forest, with the weather right, etc etc. But I see this more along the lines as an equal: Yin-Yang relationship to a monk. Preparation with a druid, means victory. But they are equally screwed when not in the right position/condition for battle.

That being said. I do agree that they could do with more flavor and love...But I (just IMHO) Would rather see more of a path selection kind of fare...

A selection to improve brew perhaps?

A selection for extra ability in combat. Similar to what a bard gets in the city.

A selection For the Druid staff to actually be a magically enhanced permanent "does something special here" weapon

A Selection that changes the nature and ability of or variety of their trapping skill.

A selection that gives them another forest only maledictive type spell..?

And just while I'm havin' a quick think.

Monks converted to A Questable Lvl 30 Qclass from Wars. In exchange, open them to two races.

Werebeast. As there are humans. Even though they under go a change. Argue the pros and cons. But Werebeasts seem to need another class, because the ones they have other then druid, kinda arn't on par with the other races that can choose them. And when you transform you don't have that, "Well now I only have one defense and can't weapon cleave" problem. Ohh and they are neutral only...So yeah for a neutral monk choice right? shrug..

Feral. Another one to argue about. But essentially people seem to think they are lacking in the "points/balance-too-low-strength/rely too much on one skill/my vulns too big" position. But they were once human, even if perverted and corrupted. And I'm sure it's not a huge leap of faith to imagine an evil monk Lvl 50 PC, taking a neutral feral baby into it's evil monastery and start teaching it's ways.?.? Shrug..

p.s. They can train their weapons as Wars. No more whining about that aspect of monk training. And a certain amount of commitment is required to lvl to 30 with selective skill training, Re-class, Catch up training at lvl 30, and go on your merry way..

Anywho...just thinkin' out loud

By the way, everyone who wants druid advice from me will be getting it shortly (in the next week).

Just started a new job and have very little time...

Hardly any time to even rank.. (7 weeks and counting to reach pinn )

And just while I'm havin' a quick think.

Monks converted to A Questable Lvl 30 Qclass from Wars. In exchange, open them to two races.

Do you know how IDEAL this would be? Monks that can be warriors first? All weapon training DONE. EASY.

Do you know how IDEAL this would be? Monks that can be warriors first? All weapon training DONE. EASY.

He does include a decent point regarding balancing this via none of these races having enough INT for one prac to 75%... you'd lose a number of pracs with the class conversion unless you decided not to practice shield block, two handed, even parry, and a number of other staple warrior skills - the same skills that are what make warriors easy to rank. You either lose practices, or you have a substantially harder time ranking to 30 as a warrior.

Regardless, I do not agree with this idea - in my opinion, there is no need to make monks a conversion class... nor do I think that it fits the RP of the monks, as the monastery is something you have devoted your life to for years before you train as a monk. I'm also not certain that I'd agree that healers, druids and shamans are balanced exactly along the lines of the other classes. All are incredibly hard to kill, on what I'd judge to be a healer>shaman>druid scale, and druids suffer a little more for the lack of prot shield... but in my near-decade here, I can count how many druid kills I've had on one hand. The only other classes I can say that about are liches, post-1.0 psis, and healers - the first two mainly from lack of contact.

Shamans just piss me off, so I go after them as soon as I can.

I wasn't going to post again as I thought it would be fruitless, seeing as Pali has addressed what I would have said otherwise.

Anywho again, my thoughts rp wise was only that at some time the disciple would have had to have been accepted into the monastary. Therefor, for simple argument sake you would have to prove that you were an able "warrior", or "skilled/special" in some way before being accept (rp stances aside).

It is primarily balanced as a way to include race expansion and new rp balance to a kind of languorous class. To flesh it out, expand it in some simple and kind of believeable manner without absolutely changing the class. And certainly wouldn't be extended to all races. Just like druids is only extended to were or human of the ranger background. Not all rangers or all human or all werebeasts have access to this, and the same could be established.

As stated I don't really think they need anything to balance them out, but people do say they wished they had more flavor for these three aspects (werebeasts/ferals/monks).

Meh...

I would just like to add that Druids are as much quest as shamans are.

I.e. they are not a quest class. Not in the real sense of the word.

So it is "not fair" (real word softened for the liking of Raargant ) to compare them to liches, vamps and crusaders.

Yeah, holy crap. How dare they even COMPARE them to other qclasses. DARN.

I think druids should be granted one hit kills on Arbor Day.

personally I have never thought of Druid's being a qclass either...however, whenever anyone throws up the ol' good/neutral/evil qclass/qrace lists...Druid is always put on there for neutrals...

So, as it stands...we don't even have a qclass/qrace for Neutrals...just one qclass that can be all paths (Psi)

This doesn't change the original idea behind the Druid having more races opened up to it (feral perhaps?) or brew being altered so that the Druid is able to provide more toward party members. I would have fully agreed that some type of Prot shield, if nothing else, should be offered to them...but I was sure that idea would be considered a bit too much... "shrug"

I have said for years half-elf and gnome druids would be awesome.

Off topic, neutrals need a qrace. not a new qclass. a qrace. Whet that should be I have no idea, but then we would not get these "druids arent a real qclass" comments.

@foxx You said druids do not compare to liches, vamps, and saders, but I know that a certain druid spanked atleast one of each of these. So I will edit you post and explain how they do not compare, meaning NO applications, NO limit to the number allowed, and NO chance to FAIL the quest. On the battlefield we call Aabahran, druids certainly compare and compete against any of these qthings.

Still thinkin' out loud and stuff

I wonder if the difficulty of creating a neutral Qrace for balance would mostly be role-play? Who says for PK purposes you cant build a class and give it to some "too cool for school" neutral and allow them to PK everything in range, as Crusaders/avatars/psis/undead/demons/lich/vamp. The paradox is that these other good/evil Q-Apps are by Rp expected to engage actively in the "EXTREMES" of the RP/PK spectrum. A Neutral, or more specifically a Neutral Neutral; true balance Q-race would have to have damn good RP behind its race that not only allows, but encourages Pk as much as the rp. Which is counter intuitive to what we kinda want from our Neutrals?

Still thinking out loud here... Any way, you would also have to provide the Rp race with enough "ACCEPTABLE" PK targets, or else they are a Neutral Qrace, waiting to get jumped, not actively supposed to jump evils and questioned for jumping goods at the best of times. I'm sure everyone has a different take on all this, but this is just a "mind storming" kinda forum anyway, so hoohum, I will try and have a crack at it anyway.

Gargoyl

Somewhere in the sands of time, the Gods of balance felt that the sway of power amongst the mortals of the lands where beginning to tip. As the sands fell further, they attempted to address this balance and instituted the organization of watcher. Yet time was not kind to the lands, And the efforts of the Watchers, while not in vain could never fully bring peace, nor stem the corruption that was destroying the lands. Thus finally, in frustration, the Gods of balance stole from the sands of time a grain for themselves. And with magics siphoned from the towers of Savant, they brought to creation a creature of ageless form and unyielding motive. A being of stone, sent to be the eyes of balance. To fight the battles and tips the scales against the mightiest of foes. A winged being, that sits within the sky watching with unwavering devotion as the sands of time fall on.

Some possible Bonuses/perks - Some/or all?

Mental vuln

May heal, regen Hp, like an ogre, but only while sleeping. Lose extra saves while sleeping across the board. Extremely weakened while in this state.

Made of stone. Giant's resistance to physical

fly

no size change

ergo..make them as tough and resilient as a giant without the size and damage/base hp bonuses...and give them fly?

add in a Qrace skill set perhaps. Eg. Falcon werebeast werepower may fit?

Possible Rp/Pk conditions for balance

May not hunt/group with any other Qclass/Race bar Neutral Psi

RP must be of timeless emotionless devotion to the cause you have forsaken your mortality, connection and emotional life for.

Must choose a favorite enemy like a ranger and have a damn good reason why that is the enemy that they have chosen to "Balance" out. + = Gargoyl that has deep deep RP, At least one immediatly acceptable set of enemy's + = rounded Qrace Rp/PK ratio?

Tyrifon The Obsidian.

Someone seems to have left a large, dark, glass like statue before you.

As you look upon it you notice it is flawless in creation. Each line

of its chiseled form looks as smooth as tight bound satin. From head

to toe you cant help but take notice each aspect of its perfectly crafted

form.

The craftsmen must have modeled this statue on some form of Human or

half even-kin creature. Its hard to tell, for though it bears the most

resemblance to a human, the glint of the end of those pointed ears looks

fierce and sharp. Almost as sharp as the grin that was sculptered to

that dark, glass face. And was it intention to leave the head so bald

and smooth that the light seems to reach deeply into that opaque skull?

But there are features that the craftsman has included, that distort

this sculpture. Wings, large and foreboding have been crafted onto the

back of this statue. They were left at rest, folded to the back and are

deceptive as to their actual size. But it is also the talons and claws

the craftsman has utilized that add a sinister aspect to the perfection

of this creation. Indeed the talons that stand for feet appear to

actually be grasping into the earth, rather then sitting upon it. And

the slight reflection of light that shine off the tip of her talons

appears to sharp and tiny to have been crafted by any chisel.

But the most ominous aspect of this statue before you, is that it appeared

that the breast of this creature just rose and fell as if in breath. Now

how would a craftsman be able to reproduce that?