It's not about hoarding information. It's about being too lazy to go find it out on your own. Where's the thrill of finding a new area or shiny on your? Now it's just "Let's go to Area 5 on our list and get a number 13." "Okay! What about a 6 too?"
Whatever, it's your game. Do what you want. I'll support and promote it just the same. But in my heart, I'll know the truth.
I recently tried another mud, where I found out what equipment was good to get and where to get it over chats and on forums. Guess what? That didn't detract from the experience of actually going out there and getting the item and wearing it and seeing my score sheet improve. The feeling was all the same, and I loved it. I didn't have to run around clueless for a few months before being able to use some good equipment. Why should new players in Forsaken Lands? Especially so since this thread is about posting where to find some decent, basic non-rare items.
How about instead of telling them what area/mob, give them the id file of all non-rares, and let them find them on their own?
Telling them what area/mob has them just kinda wastes time in going and getting worthless things.
To be honest, I'm all about helping noobs. Yes, I spoonfeed. But I can't teach someone how to PK. So all my help in telling them what eq is good, what isn't and whatever else won't matter when they get bashlocked because they don't keep protective shield up. So, let all these noobs snatch up the good rares, it just makes it easier for to get them. They're all in one place instead of all over the lands.
P.S.
I recently tried another mud' date=' where I found out what equipment was good to get and where to get it over chats and on forums. Guess what? That didn't detract from the experience of actually going out there and getting the item and wearing it and seeing my score sheet improve. The feeling was all the same, and I loved it. I didn't have to run around clueless for a few months before being able to use some good equipment. Why should new players in Forsaken Lands? Especially so since this thread is about posting where to find some decent, basic non-rare items.[/quote']
Blasphemy!
How about instead of telling them what area/mob, give them the id file of all non-rares, and let them find them on their own?
Telling them what area/mob has them just kinda wastes time in going and getting worthless things.
To be honest, I'm all about helping noobs. Yes, I spoonfeed. But I can't teach someone how to PK. So all my help in telling them what eq is good, what isn't and whatever else won't matter when they get bashlocked because they don't keep protective shield up. So, let all these noobs snatch up the good rares, it just makes it easier for to get them. They're all in one place instead of all over the lands.
P.S.
Blasphemy!
We arent even talking about rare eq.... Honestly.. You lot... Shocking.
Here's more than I had spoon-fed to me:
Basics for lvl 30+ :
Evils - Search below Miruvhor in the sewers. Also explore around the tainted valley. Search around the Pentagram.
Neutrals - Same as evils. Also search the caves north of Rheydin.
Goods - (Sorry about your luck;)) Search the Chasm. Check out Thalos.
ALL: Explore troll village, mountains near Kesrick, and the sunken ship west of Val Miran.
Newbies: Make sure to "consider" mobs in those areas first, also, some will be agressive and might kill you at early ranks. All in the name of learning though.
Cheers!
I swear to God, Krishna, or whoever is listening...the next "vet" that says spoon-fed will be armbarred in my mind. Spoon-fed my arse. Lets be honest, at some point in history every action we can ever take on this planet was done for the first time by someone. Then that person wrote down the skills they learned, the pitfalls they faced, and the techniques that helped them out. That is called teaching...you think they decide to let you be a doctor after you start slicing fools open all willy nilly? If I wanted you to inject that stuff into my mind I wouldn't have a debilitating fear of needles. Instead of leaping up on your soapbox with your catch phrase "spoon fed" (I swear the months of asking questions and reading spoon fed somewhere in the response is flooding back to me, thank god I have kickboxing in an hour.), teach someone something...maybe answer a question that at some point you asked, not because you need some e-johnson stroking for being such a 1337 "vet" but because you care enough about the topic (you have been playing here for years...instead of you know, investing or sailing around the world or something else earth-shattering) to teach the new wave who will one day replace you...and for Vishnu's sake, do it with some ****ing humility.
Wow... He's so angry he went all Hindu on us...
Just showing off my diverse religious knowledge...I almost dropped Martin Luther's name in there but it just didn't fit any of it. I'm not angry at the game or anyone in particular, but if you talk down to someone in the street you get your mouth busted...here you get called a vet. Anyone else go all "question mark?" when you think about that?
Anything posted here, can easily be gained by asking about it in game. What's so hard about doing that?
Outside of the fact that basically everyone who isn't a healer or Herald is most likely going to kill you before you get out a "Hail!", that the response to asking for a bit of a pointer (not the specific room, mob, and zip code) is greeted with "too busy" even when the person you asked has an empty PK range and no one to group with, and you have to swallow about 4.37 gallons of piss and wind about how stupid you are for not knowing this extremely simple thing...nothing.
On a happier note: My girlfriend just brought me microwavable pancakes...that's called victory in can. Or a roughly discus shaped foodstuff in a pouch of victory...which ever.
Krins, please moderate the tone of your posts. If you are too angry to post, please wait until you are calmer. It's been a long while since any forum bans have been handed out, and I would like to keep it that way. Thank you.
Outside of the fact that basically everyone who isn't a healer or Herald is most likely going to kill you before you get out a "Hail!"' date=' that the response to asking for a bit of a pointer (not the specific room, mob, and zip code) is greeted with "too busy" even when the person you asked has an empty PK range and no one to group with, and you have to swallow about 4.37 gallons of piss and wind about how stupid you are for not knowing this extremely simple thing...nothing.[/quote']
I think you'll find that us vets who defend the old ways are the ones who DON'T do this at all, and that in game we are the ones who are all about helping newbs out.
The fundamental difference between us is not that we feel people shouldn't be helped along, but that we feel most or all of that helping should take place in game. EDIT: For example, I'm not really supportive of putting an eq list up on the forums, even just of non-rares, but my chars are almost always perfectly willing to remove their best eq and let people ID it if asked properly, or tell them where to find stuff or what it does.
Well then, it sounds like I've been asking the wrong people. Anyone offended, my bad. Doesn't change the fact that my words are true. To be perfectly honest I'm not even mad. I just don't accept someone speaking to me like they are some kind of higher being. Yeah its just a forum, but the spoon fed comment drug it up and it had to be voiced. I'm sure I'm not the only one who wants to boot someone in the head for making a high and mighty comment like "that isn't how I learned...stop asking for handouts nub." (yes I realize no one says that verbatim but the message is between the lines)
We really need to get over this new school versus old school mentality that is currently dividing the playerbase. The animousity is really hurting us.
If we are going to
the newbies, at least use the Corpsestomp idea and give the ID files with no area.
As it appears to me that they are mostly incapable of doing the notepad list thing until they get veterans.
Either way, create a new Thread in newbie folder and allows us to add equipment with posts, while someone appendix the list at post nº 1.
Look, if we give up the identify files, we've just hurt a spell. The identify spell is one of the few things that makes casters/communers unique.
And the idea of listing the area, well, they still have to find the area.
Fem-Nec: I agree that you can ask in game. But it's so often I find that everyone's busy hunting, training, etc....sometimes you can't even get a response back. Not to mention, the response you get is limited by the knowledge and bias of the person you're asking.
Here they have the option of exploring and finding these things for themselves, plus if they discover a way to identify if they don't already have it, they've learned even more.
I don't want to spoonfeed anyone. I want the newer players to learn enough in a few months time and not have to invest thirty hours a week for that time period to keep them interested. Out of 100% of newbs that come, I still predict us losing roughly 15%-20% due to lack of interest or wanting to go back to their more familiar mud. We'll never get 100% retention. But this is going to be a huge boost to keeping people around.
And why do we still have this "veteran" "elite" statuses? I just consider myself experienced these days. These terms are ssa backwards and are just a version of old school/new school. We need to overcome this. SOON.
ID spells: No. The spell exists for a reason.
Area listed: Yes.
General stats: Yes
Sorry to get you so riled up Krins. I agree with Pali's post. Also, to be completely honest, I played this great game for almost TWO years before I even KNEW that there was a forum at all. First time I logged on and read the old MOTD the link didn't work to the forums then so I just did not try it after that. By the time I even learned of the forum I had had multiple pinned characters. Knew a ton of the equipment out there(Was a dummy here, made a healer specifically to id things and instead of making a comp folder for it I literally wrote down all the id's on a few yellow notepads.lol). I knew how to get through winter and gear, and a lot of the rares out there period. I know some might just think "So what?" My point is that I learned ALL of that IG. I challenged people constantly. When someone wore something I had not seen I asked about it. If they would not help me out I asked everyone else IG about it until I had an answer. There is a great sense of accomplishment in making a lot of your own discoveries in this manner. Also my first pinned character I had no idea how to even "roll" so I pinned an ogre warrior with a 38 roll and played him to damn near condeath. (Not meant to sound so egotistical here-->) It just made me "that" much better from sticking that kinda thing out.
And because of all that, you mind other people putting effort into making a list that tells newbies where to find mithril, red dragon, chimera, tainted, chasm armor, etc and what sort of bonuses it gives without posting ID's? I'm all for giving new players a platform from which they can progress, rather than just letting them stumble around cluelessly. This is not about Winter, Gear or Desolation. It's about Old Thalos, Tainted Valley and the Chasm mountains.
I guess it's all about personal preference on every scale. When I was an ubernewb, I don't think I would have used that information to find those places. I am by no means a vet at all, but I still prefer to find things on my own in game. I remember getting gifted a fiery dagger from some ninja years ago and I was tearing up brownies in Emerald. This new wonder that was this fiery dagger lit up my world for a little bit, forced me to ask someone about it, then I found how to get it and then had access to all of the elemental canyon items. Sure they're not good at all, but it was as good as getting a pk, just figuring that place out. So from the perspective of a newish player, I'm saying I agree with some of these vets. But again, there are people who like to learn every facet of a game, and there are people who want the eq lists so they can jump into the mix. I personally feel you're losing part of the experience by being ooc gifted the lists, but I also feel that it wouldn't be wrong to give newer players access to them.
