give warrior skillset doublesheath, AND raise fire/stone/storm dex by +1

giving warriors doublesheath was already proposed and flatly shot down by Behrens himself. buy hey another shot wouldnt hurt eh? so what does anyone think of either of these two ideas. test port sillyness or doable?

If it was already shot down by Behrens, and you know this, I fail to see why you spend the time to propose it again.

As for the dex + 1 boost... shrugs I don't really think they need it, honestly.

Alright. You first have to make the case as to why you want this change and the balance ramnifications behind it....

The main reason why nobody plays stone giants is that nobody (except me then) plays neutrals.

And when someone finally does, they can pick ogre, or minotaur also. I think stone giants are a bit underestimated, though ogres might be on top still.

argh, i got nothin'.

1. Warriors already have it, if you want it so badly get the lore

2. Warriors already ahve it, if you want it so badly get the lore

Zerks would get it before warriors IMHO, other classes get doublesheath yes true but don't start about ( they get it why don't I?) unless you're ready to start giving other classes warrior abilities. Sword lore is weak and gimps fine, then design a new sword lore maybe one that goes along with doublesheath so it's better to choose. Yeah I'm the new guy (again) but asking for an ability like it without good reasons to back it won't get you anything except a burn from Chayesh most likely.

Ok now the dex, let's look at the stats:

Stone: Str: 24 Int: 16 Wis: 16 Dex: 16 Con: 24

Fire: Str: 25 Int: 15 Wis: 15 Dex: 16 Con: 23

Storm: Str: 23 Int: 17 Wis: 17 Dex: 16 Con: 22

Ok yeah very low there, one point isn't going to make that much of a difference. But you have to think of their other stats. They all have a low dex and with the exception of a storm their con and str makes up for this. A fire giant is huge he's not going to be moving almost as good as a dwarf or gnome. It goes back to D&D where you'd have a -4 dex and a +4 str, they're going to make up for each other in the end. Giants get bonuses to skills and resistance to damage meaning they can be hit more anyways and have more hp than other races. If you'd like a race with more dex I'd say Dwarf and Duergar are great choices. Str: 21 Int: 17 Wis: 20 Dex: 20 Con: 22? You're only loosing 1 con there and 4 str from a fire giant. You are however gaining 2 int, 5 wis, and 4 dex. There's races out there for any way you want to play your class, just because your favorite race isn't it that doesn't mean it needs to be changed.

Seems to me if anything should happen to a giant's dex, I'd say lower Ogre's dex by one. 18 dex just seems over the top to me, especially for such a huge, healthy creature.

Nah leave it at 18, they get less racial benefits so the dex is fine where it's at. If they gained anything else racial though I'd say drop it one or two depending on what they got.

Don't forget the nice regen an ogre has. I think lowering ogre dex was a good idea.

Don't forget the nice regen an ogre has. I think lowering ogre dex was a good idea.

Yeah and the extreme vuln to all things magical doesnt matter?

Not that im saying ogres are not buff...indeed many are, but in truth from the perspective of playing C/C's all my FL Life, i must say i dont think there has been but a small handful of ogres that have given me issues...

Heck with Vorqwuith it was always easier to fight an ogre than anything else, heck if they were an ogre i enjoyed it haha...most often getting an easy soul.

With my Invokers, Aarianna and Reannaean (mysterum elder / temporum trusted) an ogre was always an easy kill, i dont think any gave me trouble in their time.

Ogres may get that regen and that dex but they pay a price for it with their vuln. A vuln that hurts, badly. I remember a certain ogre warmaster that Aarianna just destroyed over and over, even when they were decked, more so actually as call lightning is the bane of decked characters, throw in that vuln and they are like soft tallow in the oven

I think the warrior lore's should be looked at, with an additional skill added for each lore, but thats just my opinion...I mean icly you spend your whole life working to be better in the lands then anyone else with one weapon...and all you can come up with is one single attack, or skill, that is only usually helpful if fighting one class...kinda lame. On a side note, I do like warriors, I just think their current play style is fairly cookie-cutter, and way to eq dependent...instead of a warrior relaying on tactics or techniques that they learn through thier guild, its let me get a big hit dam and hope I can lag lock someone, and have enough hp to last.

Edit: Is it even cool to discuss changes to the lores on the forum?

I think the warrior lore's should be looked at, with an additional skill added for each lore, but thats just my opinion...I mean icly you spend your whole life working to be better in the lands then anyone else with one weapon...and all you can come up with is one single attack, or skill, that is only usually helpful if fighting one class...kinda lame. On a side note, I do like warriors, I just think their current play style is fairly cookie-cutter, and way to eq dependent...instead of a warrior relaying on tactics or techniques that they learn through thier guild, its let me get a big hit dam and hope I can lag lock someone, and have enough hp to last.

Edit: Is it even cool to discuss changes to the lores on the forum?

You obviously know very little about most of the lores...

as the fact is most warriors choose backcutter/powergrip (because they are the easiest to understand) and ironically enough are the weakest/least useful lores.

Edit: Is it even cool to discuss changes to the lores on the forum?

We will happily take warrior lore suggestions. Since it is a selectable skill, I would ask that you take specific changes (rather than the general ones discussed here) to the prayer forum. My personal feel is that most of the skills are excellent, but a few may need tuneups. (I haven't had the opportunity to use all of them).

We will happily take warrior lore suggestions. Since it is a selectable skill' date=' I would ask that you take specific changes (rather than the general ones discussed here) to the prayer forum. My personal feel is that most of the skills are excellent, but a few may need tuneups. (I haven't had the opportunity to use all of them).[/quote']

As for changes, I think the best change to warrior lores would be to make all effects last at least 2 ticks instead of the current 1...

As for changes' date=' I think the best change to warrior lores would be to make all effects last at least 2 ticks instead of the current 1...[/quote']

Or stack in regards to the time?

You obviously know very little about most of the lores...

as the fact is most warriors choose backcutter/powergrip (because they are the easiest to understand) and ironically enough are the weakest/least useful lores.

Heh I understand them, and some of them are fairly useless, definetly need to consider what race you're playing when selecting your lores, wrong race/lore combo can equal an ineffective warrior. My idea, is remove the expertise choices, keep the weapon mastery, and get two unique skills to your char's prefered weapon. I.E. Staff, you get the powergrip/backcutter, plus two skills unique to using a staff. Perhaps an added defense, and a skill that does something, with a push effect for instance. Generally, a staff is going to be one of the longest weapons, the added reach should have some interesting benefit. Dagger masters get the fiegn/doublesheath option with mastery, and say eye gouge, where it blinds for at least a dirt kick, if not a tick longer. Perhaps give dagger masters edgecraft and throw. These might be a bit overpowered, its debatable, I suppose, but those are just two examples of the types of changes I'm thinking of. It would make warriors more reliant on thier prefered weapons I suppose, but it also makes them a bit more unique, with more tactics that can be used instead of dirt/disarm/lag/warriorlore if applicable/laglock/etc. I think it also means that warriors will have a bit better chance at surviving, if not decked.

Edit: Or keep one weapon expertise, and get one skill, who knows, could even let the warrior choose between a skill, or an expertise.

2nd Edit: Take Pugil from each warrior, make it a staff mastery only skill for them, give them that, plus something extra, and thier lore.

I like that dagger mastery idea. Seems like you get to know one well enough, you can make and throw one. Without autothrow would it even be overpowered?

No sick ogre wars you say? Wasn't it L-A that played the fem ogre war back in the day and crushed everyone? But then again I also remember "someone" making that dk and litterally getting kills by only using trip. As far as wars go I don't play them anymore so I don't really know/care about them these days. If you're going to give an idea though alteast balance it, something along the lines of this (off the top of my head):

Reckless Strike:

The warrior swing with beyond the strength of a mortal being and cleaves into his enemy. This attack is so strong that it has been known to shatter weapons in half, both the warrior and in some cases the weapon of the defender.

small % chance of destroying own weapon, smaller % of destroying opponents.

Yeah it's not my best idea ever but just an example.

Its open to debate, all the balancing and all that, I just really think warriors shouldn't be so similiar, skill and tactic wise, warrior lore makes little difference in how a warrior is going to fight you. I mean say I'm a warrior with a polearm lore, fighting a blademaster, unless my polearm is hitting some sort of vuln, I think I'd go with a weapon a blademaster can't use, still...the extra proficiney helps with weapon expertise or mastery, but I think weapon selection plays a bigger role in how your battle goes, as opposed to your weapon proficeny. At the very least, something like what I've proposed would add some flavor and flair to warriors.

No sick ogre wars you say? Wasn't it L-A that played the fem ogre war back in the day and crushed everyone? But then again I also remember "someone" making that dk and litterally getting kills by only using trip.

Have no clue what you're talking about, I'm a mid 2.0