Make moderate more attractive.

A common complaint I see posted here is that people log off too often to avoid fights. I expect a big reason for that is the expectation of a loot.

When I played Aidon I was the only moderate at level 50. It was hard though. I got my ass stomped alot in pk. Part of that is because I suck, but part of it is because it was really hard to balance my equipment for various fights. I could stack ac really well, snd I could stack saves...but I had to hard choose between the two for every fight. Sometimes I had to go kill mobs for rares because I couldn't hold enough to create a swap suit. I got some good kills but ultimately the char was a pk fail.

Another big problem was with fewer rares every rares was godly to me. If I lost my acid etched arm plates my equipment took a huge hit.

I am currently slowly ranking a char, but not at 50 so can't see the 50 level pk flags. Are there any mods running around?

What would it take for you to play a moderate? 

My mind goes to the ability to bind and make nonrare one item via rp points, or maybe instead of a rare limit, separate rare and unique limits, or maybe not counting weapons toward the rare limit.

To make moderate more attractive, I'd say give them some of the quality of life spells for free.

Recall, Detect invis, Detect magic, locate, identify and maybe even Sanctuary.

A bump to Rp point gains from logs and interactions with other characters

The problem I see is people won't fight one-sided fights where the other person can stop them from doing anything.  Think of a faerie thief trying to equip themselves when a fire giant berserker is around.  What happens if they get caught?  Enlarge yourself all you want, that fire giant can stop you from using any skills.  So the answer in most cases is run away until you are ready.  Logging out is the ultimate form of running away as then you cannot be attacked at all.  People sometimes don't mind playing the underdog if they have a chance.  I don't think people log because they may lose gear.  I think they log because they stand very little chance and even if they do everything right with the gear they have, luck could not go their way and they can be bashlocked to death.

I will likely never play a moderate because I love to be able to loot and I love the thrill of PK knowing there is a possibility of being looted. (Ironically I hate reequipping more than anything so you'd think I'd be much more likely to play a moderate). That being said, I think Moderate characters are critical to newer players or players that want to play more casually and not potentially lose everything after one PK. UB's suggestion above sounds great, actually. I can't think of a way this could be abused since the vets won't NEED access to these QoL spells, but it could mean a lot to newbies/casual players. We have access to a lot of QoL spells  via spellforge anyway, I say take those away and give it to Moderates for free. :)

It seems to me that there is not a problem with playing Moderate.

I have played a lot of them.

The problem that does exist, remains an equipment problem.

If an item gives great saves AND increased hit and damage, the creator feels obligated to make it rare. Most non rare equivalents make the Moderate choose one or the other.

Therefor, if I play a moderate, I can have Great AC and saves with moderate H&D, or great H&D with moderate AC and saves.

While this makes me less likely to win in PK, gimped as some would say, it is a choice to live a life of moderation.

I am not against the suggestions to grant them quality of life spells, but it seems to me that if Moderate is training wheels, then further buffs are riding in the grass creating greater dependency on the protection provided.

Finally, lets not forget that being a moderate provides more protection than just not being looted. There is also a PK protection from someone who kills you for a limited time. I often wonder if this is necessary, few players these days continue to kill any enemy over and over again.

Just the opinion of someone who actually plays them.

Moderates will become more desirable if rares are toned down. What you're describing about having to pick and choose stats on equipment used to apply to all items don't forget. 

The jack of all trades equipment (stuff with all desirable stats) shouldn't be the master of them too. 

Once this is addressed, you'll find things like moderates will find their way back to being desirable sooner or later.

This right here is the point I was making

7 minutes ago, Wade said:

Moderates will become more desirable if rares are toned down. What you're describing about having to pick and choose stats on equipment used to apply to all items don't forget. 

The jack of all trades equipment (stuff with all desirable stats) shouldn't be the master of them too. 

Once this is addressed, you'll find things like moderates will find their way back to being desirable sooner or later.

If you can get enough stats to make armor a moot point, then the baseline armor class raises to compete.  The trouble isn't really damage though in the armor, it is damage AND superior protection.  Glass cannons should exist, but they should be glass cannons, not mithril-reinforced tanks with mounted cannons and a barrier of spell turning.  I still stand by my idea of balance: If you cannot kill someone unless they make a mistake, then they should not be able to kill you unless you make an equivalent mistake.  In today's FL, that's just not the case.  I still support a system where class selections determine more what classes you will do well against, not the class itself.  The necro revamp I think was a wonderful addition.  I see so many go the bone path, but the other paths are so powerful against certain classes.

Then again. It would be interesting to see Synergies within Cabal Powers that coordinate with the Moderate perspective.

Example. Cabal Skill adds H&D, but the character is Moderate so it adds H+2&D+2, or cabal skill Improves AC, but character is Moderate so Improves it better.

On 12/5/2018 at 3:12 PM, Fool_Hardy said:

It seems to me that there is not a problem with playing Moderate.

I have played a lot of them.

The problem that does exist, remains an equipment problem.

If an item gives great saves AND increased hit and damage, the creator feels obligated to make it rare. Most non rare equivalents make the Moderate choose one or the other.

Therefor, if I play a moderate, I can have Great AC and saves with moderate H&D, or great H&D with moderate AC and saves.

While this makes me less likely to win in PK, gimped as some would say, it is a choice to live a life of moderation.

I am not against the suggestions to grant them quality of life spells, but it seems to me that if Moderate is training wheels, then further buffs are riding in the grass creating greater dependency on the protection provided.

Finally, lets not forget that being a moderate provides more protection than just not being looted. There is also a PK protection from someone who kills you for a limited time. I often wonder if this is necessary, few players these days continue to kill any enemy over and over again.

Just the opinion of someone who actually plays them.

I don't believe moderate should be training wheels. I think it should just be a different play style. I don't think people should have to feel they graduate out of moderates. I have been playing since 1.0 and never would have considered playing playing a moderate until I got to a point in my life where I have very limited gaming time. It would take me weeks at my current play alotment to get decked. 

Non-rare swap suits we're also a staple of my play. I changed half of my items out for every pk. Funnily this requires better knowledge of fl because you have to know where to find all these pieces.

My mind is now going to a moderate store where they sell some nonrare one-sided eq for rp points. Pieces that are -10 spell with no ac, pieces that are just ac, or just hitroll, etc, to help moderates build a swap suit.

I like the idea of qol buffs. I also would like to have a cure light type that only works if you haven't engaged in pk in a long time (50 ticks?), which would make resuiting faster.