bards need flails or whips or something

Since Viri redid them some time ago, bards enjoy no PK protection whatsoever.

You may kill them to your black little heart's content (within normal PK guidelines of course).

Oh...and I solo-ranked my bard through the mid-20's. It can be done.

I'm still waiting for hands free harmonica (worn on face, of course)...hehe

But really, I've played bards and pk'd with them and yes, they can be very successful even now if you pull things together a little. Bash lock is certainly their biggest nightmare as it lets warriors, etc just...well, out warrior them.

To me the feel of them was that they needed only a very slight adding to, but not much....

maybe a song that is anti-bash...but not 100% success...

As name rushes forward to bash, you strike a loud, obnoxious chord.

Name stumbles and falls flat on his face.

Okay, so kind of a silly example, but hey, its an idea, lol.

Or perhaps something in the vein of how clerics have a tailored ability from their religion in divine intervention...have a song that is unique to either religion or race.

Bard ideas, so many and they are all so fun, hah.

I like the idea of a unique song for race/religion.

as for solo ranking, just master edge craft and throw, no sweat.

I try to think of it as if i am playing myself...

ie if i was a bard could i kill a clone of me that is a warrior

i think of the attacks and counters and the damage i would probably do... most of the time i feel the bard looses!

I think it would rock if there were quests bards could do for other bard tavern keepers to actually GET songs, kind of the way a certain qclass thing is that I can't mention, but most of you will get.

I mean it would be neat for bards to be able to learn INDIVIDUAL songs.

It would also be cool if bards could edit the words of their songs.

Here's an idea: bards get the cabal-controlling-area bonus no matter what the bonus requirements are. For example, Nexus-controlled areas give a damage bonus to evil aligned characters only. The exception to this rule would be bards, who would get the bonus no matter what their alignment (only when in that particular area, of course). Same for Knight hp regeneration (doesn't have to be good-aligned), Warmaster movement regen (doesn't have to count as melee class), and Savant mana regen (doesn't have to count as mage/communer class).

It would reflect the Jack of all trades angle (i.e. bards finding a way to take advantage) but is neither overpowering nor completely useless.

You're thinking Gehenna from the Child of Lies plot. Demon, not undead, and not Conclave. Had fun hunting the thing down a few times with Galadran.

Here's an idea.

Bard gets a 'bard-quest' from their guildmaster.

Bard completes quest.

Bard is now qualified to bestow that quest non-bards.

Or something to that effect. Seems like a neat idea, and very appropriate for a well-traveled minstril.