Remove Sanctuary/Normalize Damage

I think sanctuary should just be removed from the game. At one point it was a good thing and I don't disagree with its usefulness. However the fact that EVERYONE has it on all the time now makes it just feel like another upkeep. Even catching someone without sanc means that person flees and puts up sanc first. That says something about the difference between a fun gameplay mechanic and a chore to do everytime you log in. We have enough tasks to do so why not just take something that is viewed as a chore and remove it?

On the other side if sanc gets removed why don't we just nerf damage a bit across the board towards players? I know that players are already flagged differently for certain things and I'm sure there is a happy place that could be found to balance it out.

All in all I personally think that sanctuary is just something to use against new players who don't understand it as opposed to something interesting to do.

Please don't compare this to flight/enlarge/protection, you CAN fight without those, fighting without sanctuary is an instant death sentence without other extreme mitigating factors.

I have some ideas for another spell to possibly take its place if I don't get shouted down for thinking such heresy. :D

Hmm I can see where you're coming from except on the new player perspective.  It took only one time of someone saying always have sanc ready or up for me to search the consumable list and find different forms in game.  However I'd take your ideas a bit further in some ways, remove the consumables for sanctuary as well as some others and remove invoker's ability to cast it on others as well as any other highly offensive damage dealing class.  Your complaint carries over to the big two that I see mostly.  Clan/Cabal promotion and consumables.  I'm of the opinion that we should make consumables rot on logout and have short duration time and increase reliance on support classes.

Take away sanc and you will steer the phase more towards melee.  Casters have it and a way to dispel it.  It's a needed game mechanic.  It's easy to get so it shouldn't be a problem.

1 minute ago, Chesta6384 said:

Take away sanc and you will steer the phase more towards melee.  Casters have it and a way to dispel it.  It's a needed game mechanic.  It's easy to get so it shouldn't be a problem.

I believe his point was more towards the fact that everyone has it not just casters.  Warriors, Rangers, Berserkers, Blademasters, Monks etc... these classes that are more defensive and can be more offensive have almost all the benefits of casters.  Sure a caster can dispel it but as I learned it's more dangerous for a caster to be dispelled than a melee because the melee in most cases reapplies easier.

I feel that sanctuary could still be useful against NPCs.  But yes, sanctuary being removed as a factor in PK would be a welcome change.  If casters are more vulnerable without sanc, why not add some kind of damage reduction for certain milestones of -AC.  Granted removing sanc would buff pet classes as you woulnd't need to find/employ group sanc items in PK.

What would be your opinion about removing consumables and creating a neutral class that's purpose was to buff and heal the group vs combat and allow that to be a remaining source?

44 minutes ago, Ambroas said:

What would be your opinion about removing consumables and creating a neutral class that's purpose was to buff and heal the group vs combat and allow that to be a remaining source?

Noone will play it. Classes that are centred around supporting someone else are never desired. Look at the support role in LoL. Besides, we kinda have such class already. It's called healer.

As for the main suggestion itself, @Demiterracotta - you suggest a lot of changes which will generally do nothing. Keeping an eye on your

sanctuary is a very important skill that separates the mediocre from the bad. Keeping an away on the enemy's sanctuary is a skill that separates the good from the mediocre. 

PS. Someone seriously needs to look at the formatting of this forum.

There are diehard fans of support in LoL...just look at aphromoo

10 hours ago, f0xx said:

Noone will play it. Classes that are centred around supporting someone else are never desired. Look at the support role in LoL. Besides, we kinda have such class already. It's called healer.

As for the main suggestion itself, @Demiterracotta - you suggest a lot of changes which will generally do nothing. Keeping an eye on your

sanctuary is a very important skill that separates the mediocre from the bad. Keeping an away on the enemy's sanctuary is a skill that separates the good from the mediocre. 

PS. Someone seriously needs to look at the formatting of this forum.

Only hit return for a new paragraph. If you're on a phone, you shouldn't be creating new lines with enter every sentence. If you're on a computer, press ctrl+enter to create a no-space line. 

If you have an issue with quote not being removed, there is a light socket icon on the left side of the format bar. Click it, delete the bbcode and then unclick it and continue.

19 hours ago, f0xx said:

Noone will play it. Classes that are centred around supporting someone else are never desired. Look at the support role in LoL. Besides, we kinda have such class already. It's called healer.

As for the main suggestion itself, @Demiterracotta - you suggest a lot of changes which will generally do nothing. Keeping an eye on your sanctuary is a very important skill that separates the mediocre from the bad. Keeping an away on the enemy's sanctuary is a skill that separates the good from the mediocre. 

PS. Someone seriously needs to look at the formatting of this forum.

My point is sanctuary itself currently does nothing. Sanctuary tends to be a moot point in almost every fight, we all talk about the damage we do through sanctuary, it's what we already do. Can dispelling someones sanc and getting a single round in turn the fight? You betcha, so can landing a trip at the right time, leading them into a trap, catching them asleep, or dispelling any other buff, the difference is those buffs affect certain aspects of the fight instead of 'you HAVE to have this or you died six rounds ago, oh and they have it to'

But lets be honest, sanctuary awareness can barely be considered a skill, having fought you across a few characters I can say that you kicking the everliving CRAP out of me at every turn has never had to do with sanctuary management. I caught you without sanc for a round once and the fight still wasn't even close. Your knowledge and skill and any other persons would barely be impacted by the removal of sanctuary. And in all of the awesome advice you have thrown my way, you have never said 'Hey man, I see you have that whole white aura thing down, awesome job.' We take it for granted that sanctuary is just there or you are running away.

As to casters, there's a reason I said damage would have to be worked out. It would be one thing if cast/communers were the ONLY ones with sanc, but they aren't, and with damage balanced around a lack of sanctuary you wouldn't really notice the difference.

I'm not on a crusade against any class or person, I just view sanctuary as a pointless buff at this point in time.

You'd probably have a lot better balance if you balanced classes straight out without consumables, but that would be an entire rework of the game and even then, it might not be a better system. It would certainly be a simpler system, but better balance at the cost of tactical options is not always ideal, strangely enough. The whole consumable tactical layer is controversial and that perhaps deserves a dozen threads of its own. Cutting one specific effect is very, very hard to do. The more important it is, the harder it is to rebalance, and sanctuary is about as important as they get.

I like the idea, and if we were doing a major baseline overhaul of the PK system, I'd advocate against sanctuary. However, as people have pointed out, so many current tactics revolve around the timing, denial, and removal of sanctuary that the balance ramifications would be huge. Much larger than a -50% damage shift across the board. Without those tactics, the game would be worse off in its current iteration.

It is a lot like removing lag. The mechanics behind it aren't well done, but because it is so integrated in the game play, it would be extremely difficult to work it out of our system.

Yeah its pointless until I time dispels with minister tics to get you lagged and taking increased damage by dropping your spell.

Remove sanc, then you have to give all mages some kind of vuln damage spell that makes you take extra every hit to compensate.

What if they remove sanctuary and just toned down damage in general. 

Plus remove most consumable's making it matter more that your class has access to certain spells like slow/haste/armor etc...

On 25/07/2016 at 8:20 PM, Morlhach said:

Only hit return for a new paragraph. If you're on a phone, you shouldn't be creating new lines with enter every sentence. If you're on a computer, press shift+enter to create a no-space line. 

If you have an issue with quote not being removed, there is a light socket icon on the left side of the format bar. Click it, delete the bbcode and then unclick it and continue.

I don't see this socket button, can someone screenshot it?

Also can it be made so the enter alone is a no space line (instead of control + enter)? It's how it's been working forever, now it suddenly gets changed :(

Been this way forever. Since 4.0 ipboard