Should dwarves/duergars get a mastery in this skill?( Do they already?)
Mining.
They don't and should not.
First reason: ic, just bc you're the son of a miner doesn't mean you're any good at it.
Second reason: balance wise / game mechanics: it takes very very long to master the skill and mastery is necessary to get the top few materials, unless you are extremely lucky.
Makes sense, but just to rebuttal the first point:
Don't gnomes get 100% in defuse traps? ![]()
OPenis makes sense though and is understandable for sure.
Of course from an RP perspective they should. I find absolutely no sense in Anume's first (father and son) argument.
The second argument though, is perfectly sound and you need no other reason really. Mine and harvest are some of the hardest skills to master in this game and with and rightfully so.
I think she meant just because one dwarf is good at mining doesn't mean every dwarf is. That being said, mining is specifically written INTO dwarf lore and RP.
But yeah, I can get behind the OP aspects of it.
They don't and should not.
First reason: ic, just bc you're the son of a miner doesn't mean you're any good at it.
Of course from an RP perspective they should.** I find absolutely no sense in Anume's first (father and son) argument.**
Actually, Anume made a rather mundane common sense statement. It's nearly impossible to disagree with that.
EDIT: My dad is a doctor, do I have 100% skill in medical treatments? Lol.
Actually, Anume made a rather mundane common sense statement. It's nearly impossible to disagree with that.
EDIT: My dad is a doctor, do I have 100% skill in medical treatments? Lol.
But being a doctor isn't written into the history of your people... where as mining and blacksmithing IS for dwarves.. Not only is it a major part of their culture, but they were entrusted with an almost divine knowledge of it from the Forefathers.
EDIT:
If it is a balance reason, then cool. I'm 100% for it. I think balance trumps RP.
If it is a balance reason, then cool. I'm 100% for it. I think balance trumps RP.
Totally agreed.
Also, I was responding only to f0xx's part that Anume's statement made no sense... Not the part where it's written in history, etc.
Gnome abilities for a melee class will not make the gnome over powered because gnomes are weak in melee to begin with. Giving a dwarf an advantage in the bard class would definitely lend itself toward the over powered statement. A better argument would be should dwarves and duergar have a higher chance of learning those skills based their history. Although, I found it easy to master both mining and harvest, high intelligence + learned perk. Dwarves and duergar have lower intelligence, the learned perk would help some, but I believe it will take much longer to master those skills. Like I said, a 1% bonus to learn skill mining would seem appropriate without completely destabilizing the balance of the game. Or a max of 101% for dwarves and duergar, as those who have sought mastery (worked for it) should have their racial history reflect their extreme knowledge of the craft.
I think the above is not a bad idea.
Actually, Anume made a rather mundane common sense statement. It's nearly impossible to disagree with that.
EDIT: My dad is a doctor, do I have 100% skill in medical treatments? Lol.
Comparing a racial characteristic to a profession learned at university? Tssk...
Tolkien's dwarves:
Tolkien was inspired by the dwarves of Norse myths and dwarves of Germanic folklore (such as those of the Brothers Grimm), from whom his Dwarves take their characteristic affinity with mining, metalworking, crafting and avarice.
Discworld's dwarves
Their mining has led to a longstanding enmity with trolls, who are made of rock.....The closest thing to a leader dwarfs have is a dezka-knik or chief mining engineer, a title loosely translated into Morporkian as "king".
Dungeons & Dragons's dwarves:
Most dwarves prefer living in underground cities near the surface and above the Underdark, built around mines that provide much of their livelihood.....In their own homelands, dwarves continuously carve out new living space, mining the mountains’ riches as they do so.
World of Warcraft's dwarves:
...Originally a race of miners....
Warhammer's dwarves:
The sheer power of Chaos threatened the entire world with eventual destruction.
To battle against such enemies, Grungni forged the first weapons and armour, while teaching the Dwarfs the skills of metalworking, smelting and mining.
And finally behold, Aabahran's own lore:
And so, one last
time did the Forefathers sing to the stone-soul of the world, a beautiful,
ndescribable song beyond words. And as they sang, a miracle occurred. Their
song wakened the souls of the earth itself, as sentient creatures were
suddenly birthed from the very Stone of the world itself. The Forefathers saw
that these creatures were as hardy, durable, and tough as the stone spine of
the world itself, and that they loved the mountains, canyons, and caverns as
much as the Forefathers themselves.
Saying a dwarf is not good at mining is like saying a drow is not good at sneaking, a minotaur is not good at charging, a faerie is not good at flying, a vampire is not good at sucking blood, and the sun is not good at rising from the east and setting from the west. When it comes to dwarves, mining is no mere profession - it is trait that defines the race. There's no place for opinions here. That's a fact. Dwarves that are not good at mining might as well not be dwarves.
That being said, I completely agree with Anume. I just didn't agree with the argument she used (the first one). And yes, a 101% prof at mining seems fair (no auto mastery), from both RP and balance perspective.
It is not a racial ability in fl foxx.
And it will continue not to be one ![]()
You can quote some more books now ![]()
You're confusing racial culture with racial characteristics.
Mining is cultural. Height is a characteristic.
I think its funny that this is still an argument when the problem was solved to reflect it as a racial trait for RP and balance reasons by making it 101% instead of auto-mastery..
Quoting FL's help files about dwarves is hardly quoting some random book...
Gnomes get 100% in defuse.. why? Because it is part of their gnome culture to know about devices and inventions.. But dwarves don't get the same shit when applied to their culture? Why?
They get two other racial abilites already. They won't get a third one ![]()
But I thought you liked the 101% idea..
Like I said, balance reasons, sure I get it. But denying that it makes sense is kinda lame haha
I like the 101 idea and will discuss what it would result in code-wise with Morl.
We will then see if it is actually something small, or something very big that should not be done.
It is not a racial ability in fl foxx.
And it will continue not to be one
You can quote some more books now
I am not asking it to be a "racial ability". I am not even talking about "abilities". I am talking about RP and lore. And of course it will be as you say. You are the owner of the game, after all. You can do anything your heart desires when it comes to this game. I did quote some books. Just as I quoted the Dwarf help file from FL itself, which pretty much states "dwarves love to mine".
Arguing dwarves are not guaranteed to be good at mining, entirely from an RP point of view, is like arguing illithids are not guaranteed to be good with mind magics.
It is the definition of the race. A definition that you and your team agreed on by approving the dwarf help file.
And once again, I completely agree with you that they should not get an auto mastery at mining, and that it would be nice for them to get 101% at mining, only if you and your team agree it would be OK, balance wise.
A dwarf bonus to mining does not has to be a racial mastery proficiency bonus.
It can be as simple as a small bonus to get a better ore, or a double ore.
Balanced by the a small penalty to get a worse wood, or no wood at all.
They gain something on Ore, lose on wood.
And if Dwarves get something for mining, Elves should get for woods. And the "help mining/harvest" should be update to reflect such changes.
elves should lose RP for chopping down a tree. Just kidding.