New Bards Songs. And minor fixes.

We all know bards are in the oven for some chances in the future. But until then why no quick fix some things.

1. A song of Enlargment "A Tale of Giants"

+1 size, 12 hours (at least 6 hours), need instrument.

Bards know few weapons, which means Parry and Dual parry will collapse vs anyone with an unknown weapon. Add bash, and you can't cast, sing or throw, akin to paladins but Paladins get Mounted combat, Magic Strike, cure critical and at will Sanctuary. Not to speak how Shield block or even Two handed are incomparable better than dual parry.

1. Change "Mystery of Unicorns" to reflect the room terrain type you are in.

Lava - Affective (Volcano, Pentagram)

Sand - Malediction (Forsaken lands, Waterfall)

Air - Mental (Swears,Mountain train, Cloud Kingdom, needs flight )

Water - 1/3 as save vs spell (rivers, seas)

Other terrain - random as it is now.

Move from a dumb luck system that 2/3 of the time has little use, to one of player skill.

3)A song of faerie-Fire "Dance of the Faeries".

Bards can't see hidden, nor can they prevent anyone from hide or camo.

I would propose the Spell but bards sing . Should not need instrument.

1. Fix song learning. Song training is incredibility slow. I think it uses still the old learning system.

1. Improve the THAC0 of bards to that of a Paladin/Dk, (or at least Ninja/Thief).

This is a PITA, as you can't hit Factions bosses without ridiculous high Hitroll. You will miss due to their AC. For an easy going class, such high Hitroll dependency is counter intuitive.

This one is so easy to do, just change the first zero of the bard const to a lower value (-6 or -4). Pretty please Morlhach.

While not a full reflesh of the class, this quick fixes, will most like endure and pass on to the next version of bards.

If bards are going to be changed soon, I think it's a little overkill to adjust them now. It takes time away from other projects that will have a much bigger and longer lasting impact on the game. An overhaul to army warfare, is a far more important change than a single class that gets little play as it is.

I believe you and I have discussed the current bards in great detail, and there are ways around these weaknesses in the game already. In my opinion, it is best to wait for the overhaul and not spend time on band-aids.

I see it quite the opposite. I see that they will take some time, the AMA informed us that Necros would come first, a year ago. This things take time. I also see that the fact that they get little play as it is, as a sign that they need change.

While we discusses bards quite a bit, I remember that we only agree that they have bad defenses and a problem dealing with bashes . That the best race for avoiding this is an Avian Nimble, and that the best cabal is Nexus (although we disagree on subcabal). Still a single race-cabal combo is indication that stuff is bad at the root. Specially since Lucky perk is a must if you plan to use Tarot.

• Most tarots don't necessitate lucky perk, as you are sacrificing a more relevant perk on one skill that is still mediocre at best. Also, sufficient luck is extremely easy to come by.

• There is not a single weakness they have that is not currently coverable by a cabal or race choice. While cabals should not be what determines the power of a class, I agree, one must admit that the options available for a bard (now that the can be evil) are pretty beneficial. Without saying too much, consider what Nexus can provide.

• There are at least 3 level 50 bards. From what I've seen, we only have two Necromancers left. Before that, we were low on Shamans, only Laelanis and sometimes the FG Shaman. Before that, and to some extent still now, we were low on Dark-Knights. I am unaware of any level 50 Battlemages. Thieves and Ninjas are also rare right now, and have been for a while. This class that you are advocating temp fixes for (based on the notion that people aren't playing them as they are now) is currently more popular than 6 other classes in the game (granted, one is getting an overhaul soon™), and only marginally less popular than Berserkers and Clerics.

Having 3 bards at 50 is a fluke and you know it. Even the undead and merchants play Necromancers. Even Valek plays DK's.

Bards are mainly played by those wishing to experience a new class, or those who do not plan to PK.

Those who roll a bard and think they will play a PK character quickly abandon such follies and fade into the void.

2 of the 3 bards are mine.. I think bards are chosen as they are generally lesser targets and good for new players to explore with (essentially a hardcore adventurer)

That said, I am nearly ready to abandon both. The halfling bard (while super quick to rank) did not have lucky perk and was useless for anything except RP.

The help files say 'Easy to survive' but the defenses are completely lacking. I think a way to use an instrument similar to shield block would help things as well as a boost to shield of words and battle cry.

over all the hit/dam, defenses and offenses compared to every other class I've played is quite disappointing and I struggle to see how this class would take out anybody in a fair fight.

I believe the idea is that hit/dam defense/offense should not exceed any class but it seems like all are over nerfed. A bard caught in a city should be at an advantage due to brawl etc but currently the only way I can see a bard getting an upper hand is through deceit and turning against his own group. 

The most popular tarot cards are also all but useless, even with the lucky perk. So sick of pulling that tower card.

/2 cents

There are duplicate threads on bards at the moment.

suggesting keep all replies under this thread below:

http://theforsakenlands.com/community/index.php?/topic/33730-bards-to-improve-or-not-to-improve/