making a mud

[Zrothum]

Just the "name" of the codebase. Like how we say "Oh I played in FL 1.0" That was the first version of the FL modified code.

[brsingr]

which codebase should i get? final?

[Chayesh]

Dude, you will seriously need to do some reading on the subject in order to understand all the terms. DikuMUD is a free source codebase. So is ROM, WOT, MERC and others. They all have different attributes and can do different things. Some are all built together, like FL which is a DikuMUD source. DikuMUD was built on a MERC base which was built on a ROM frame.

You'll need to study up to know what everything is.

[brsingr]

you're right...

[Zrothum]

Dude, you will seriously need to do some reading on the subject in order to understand all the terms. DikuMUD is a free source codebase. So is ROM, WOT, MERC and others. They all have different attributes and can do different things. Some are all built together, like FL which is a DikuMUD source. DikuMUD was built on a MERC base which was built on a ROM frame.

You'll need to study up to know what everything is.

*looks up at Chayesh with adorable, innocent, toddler eyes*

....why?

[brsingr]

yeah, the whole telnet problem i am having is also stopping the codebase from working. i might just burn the zip file to a floppy disk and try it on another computer, but i am having a bit of a problem finding one, and there are only 2 computers out of like 32 with internet, and the other one is a real peice of crap

[brsingr]

never quite figured that out

[Zrothum]

You trying this from school?

[brsingr]

yeah, i have permission, and due to my mother being in a blind rage yesterday, my network of computers at home is completely demolished.

[brsingr]

yeah....

[grannym4n]

Ha.....oh boy. Good luck.

[Icor]

My suggestion is, don't start. Not now, anyway. One thing almost as complicated as the code itself is learning how to get a server running. You're going to have to learn networking as well. Don't suck at algebra because you'll need it for learning C++. Learning C++ isn't a walk in the park either, it takes a very long time. Get as much out of High School as you can, code knowledge wise.

[grannym4n]

Alright, back from some classes, so I'll make a longer post.

Running a mud...is like, having a kid(or as far as I can tell). When you start, you have no idea what you're doing and you're gonna have to pretty much guess your way through for a long time. You're 13, so my advice is don't do it. I'm fairly sure you don't have enough common knowledge(this isn't a hit against you, just against what is required to run a mud) to actually get one started and running. I'll use myself as an example. When I was asked to help start a new mud with FL's code base, myself and another worked hard on smoothing out Viri's 'released' code to get it running. So yea, I finally got the build to run successfully(as Viri's code doesn't run 'out-of-the-box' ) but that's only part of the battle. You'll need a server, or your own box to run your new mud. Thing is, Diku loves Linux, not Windows. So, there's your next hurdle, getting the codebase to compile and run within Linux or a cygwin environment. Then, once your mud is up and running smoothly(which could take anywhere from a week to months) you have an empty world. Now begins the 'real' fun. Har har, note my text sarcasm. Building! Most muds have a certain version of what's called OLC which helps you create your world, one little room or npc at a time. You want a big mud? Talk about tedious my friend. Myself, I find building rather enjoyable but the average player..does not. They love playing. So say you invest tons of time and get a few people to help you and succesfully have..meh, 5000 rooms and 20 areas? Though it's full of content, the world is still dead. No coded in quests, actions, events, or anything of that sort. Here comes PROGGING, ready to bite you [la de da]. Here's your '3rd' language(following C/C++ and OLC) that you must familiarize yourself with to make your world come alive.

I'll stop there, but as you can see, it's quite an undertaking. For someone who is new to it all, and only 13, it can't be done. If you try and learn it, every 6 months you can look back and definately see how much progress you've made in your knowledge of all things text. It's actually quite amazing. But for now, I suggest you just be the student, not the entrepreneur.

I'm about 19, and had a staff varying from 1 to at most 10 for about 6 months. In that time we created 12000 rooms, 70+ areas, and progs galore. I'd say it was the best (legal)attempt to create something that branched off FL, just as FL branched off AR. But in the end I shut the doors to a crack, as controlling all aspects of a mud in development is quite possibly one of the hardest things one could every do in this community.

Do good in school, play a lot, learn OLC and try your hand at C++. If you find it fun, pursue it, I am now and loving it.

Visit: www.dawnoftime.org for a relatively easier WIN based source code that shouldn't be 'too' hard to get started if you're truly eager.

[Pali]

Then, if you try to change any classes or skills or races around, you get the REALLY hard part of balancing everything. That's a headache I'd rather not have myself.

[Chayesh]

And as Granny said, 6 months to build 12000 rooms.

I'd estimate, though I could be wrong, that FL has at least twice that, probably closer to 30000.

Additionally, the FL source, when it was released, already had classes coded and balanced; races too. If you tweak with any of that, like Pali said, Pain City: Population, You.

Also, picking good staff you can trust is the hardest part. For the most part, computers and code and whatnot are nothing but math and scripts doing what you tell them to do. People are a hell of a lot more than that and a hell of a lot trickier to deal with.

[Tantangel]

And you got to remember. Code does exactly what you tell it to do. So if you screw up one thing, the program is doing what it was told to do, thus doing the right thing, you were just wrong.

[Magick]

It's quite alot of work. And that's not even from the coding side of things. Just the building and bug finding in modified code as well as trying to balance out some spells from a stock code. IE: Fireball. It's a targeted spell. Chain lightning (as it was in the FL 1.0 era) pulled about 30 hits between yourself and the target, before loosing all power (misses) and finally grounding out through you unless the target died in the process. Major tweaking. It's hell. Really. Hell, but fun.

Pulling classes from the FL source when it was public would make things easier, but that's not the point. Balance is a royal pain when you're starting from basically scratch, as Chayesh said. About a million and one things to do. And the list gets longer as you go, despite how fast you get things done. If it's not one thing, it's another.

OLC is a godsend at times, though. Makes things MUCH easier. From digging out a 100 room area in less than 15 min, to mob/weapon/armor creation.

I <3 OLC

[Icor]

Building in OLC requires a lot of love for creativity and patience, otherwise, you will learn that it turns into a hell of a lot of WORK. Building is not for your pleasure - it is for the pleasure of everyone who will play in your areas, if anyone at all.

[brsingr]

sooooo, the BAD news is, i am in middle school, at a private school, with no computer classes. Although i do know what linux is, i dont know where to get it, or how to install an operating system, and i have got no idea what to do

the GOOD news is, i know at least 4 people who are experienced with code, and how to do less..... legal processes with the computer, I.E. hacking and stuff. unfortunately, one has just had a baby, and is rather busy, while another's grandmother died on christmas day (i know, it sucks, doesnt it?), another is in some other state, which, i dont know, and i can only communicate with through chat, and another is just always busy. i do have like 10 old desktops at my house, 1 old laptop, 1 new laptop (although i dont think i can use that one), 1 new desktop, and 1 old desktop that has a ton of memory, so memory/computerwise, i am fine. and although i now realize how difficult and annoying this will be, i will continue screwing with it untill i make something fun or useful.

also, i may be able to transfer to a public school next year, to learn about coding

[Magick]

Get books. Read. That's step 1 until you can get into classes. If something doesn't make sense at first, re-read it. If it still doesn't, find someone to get an explanation from. You'll have a jump on those in the class, when you can get in.

You can ask here, as you have, but get mixed responses in the process. The good news to this is, we're a well of information waiting to be tapped. The bad news to this is, with the varied responses might (will) lead to a derailing of thread or multiple (semi)correct answers. Keep at it though.

And remember, if none of us know the answer outright, we can more than likely show you where to look to get a correct answer.

[grannym4n]

And remember' date=' if none of us know the answer outright, we can more than likely show you where to look to get a correct answer.[/quote']

That's a good line. And I'm pretty sure I can answer most any of your questions mud wise[code/and OLC]. As could a couple other people here(Behrens, Lunicant).

Note: Some people definately did answer without 'really' knowing what it takes. But all in all, everyone has a pretty good sense of what it takes, and the appreciation to keep up the work from those that do it.

[delfytheelfy]

Ok, I have a source code, now im not sure how to start it up. I will use my own connection here @ home to run the MUD, so I can just poke around.

[grannym4n]

Oh man. I could explain, but it'd have to be the most thorough explination ever for any possibility of you getting it running. It requires so much work, if you're not even sure of where to begin and all you have is the 'source' code....you won't be 'poking around' anywere. Sorry, maybe one day when I'm bored I can post an 'in-depth' guide; but that's forever in the future.

[brsingr]

like, is there a coding for dummies book, or what?

someone post a list of good books i should try, or something?

[brsingr]

perhaps someone could make a coding forum, where you could post essays on OLC and C++, and other stuff related to coding, as well as the coding its self, and like list of websites and books for referance.