goldbond Posted October 15, 2007 Report Share Posted October 15, 2007 the best idea given here was the Forsaken i think, who said they should be forced to go Good/Evil. great idea, even better than having BLMs lose H2H. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grumpy Posted October 15, 2007 Report Share Posted October 15, 2007 except that there is absolutely no RP justification in that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lexi Posted October 15, 2007 Report Share Posted October 15, 2007 Yes, attacks have been changed and that is a good start. Now take the abilityto enfeeble, telelock and caltrap and they will probably start to be even with most other classes on the power peaks, IMHO. Mostly they are pains because they still a lot of attacks (I'd still bet its more on average than a warrior with a 2h polearm) and can stop you getting away. I still (and will always) disagree with a class being able to deal out the melee pain AND stop you running. L-A They can't do all that against everyone. Against non anatomy races, they can caltrap (out of the ones you mentioned). Do they really gain enfeeble? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evangelion Posted October 15, 2007 Report Share Posted October 15, 2007 Not in its entirety, or as powerful, vague as that may be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldbond Posted October 15, 2007 Report Share Posted October 15, 2007 and the RP justification for forcing monks to go good/evil is ...... the RP justification for BLM's in the first place is..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evangelion Posted October 15, 2007 Report Share Posted October 15, 2007 RP justification for monks being good/evil is that they must have a force to meditate on - just like clerics can only be good/evil, because they must have a firm belief, not be on the fence. RP justification for blademasters is that they are highly trained masters of combat, proficient in the use of all edged weapons. The only way to justify having blademasters be good/evil only would be to call them Samurai, because no Samurai serves two masters or himself (neutrality) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Forsaken Posted October 15, 2007 Report Share Posted October 15, 2007 Heh, you are telling me there is absolutely NO balance issue with monks being neutral? HAH! (Gimmie an ungimped neutral monk) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evangelion Posted October 15, 2007 Report Share Posted October 15, 2007 We were talking about RP reasons, not mechanics reasons. Pay attention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raargant Posted October 15, 2007 Report Share Posted October 15, 2007 RP is flexible; anything can be RP'd. Mechanics are rigid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Forsaken Posted October 15, 2007 Report Share Posted October 15, 2007 The only way to justify having blademasters be good/evil only would be to call them Samurai' date=' because no Samurai serves two masters or himself (neutrality)[/quote'] Speaks for itself. I could justify it because I think Neutral blademasters hit way to hard for the number of attacks they are capable of. That's why monks can't be neutral. (And yes, I copy and pasted the items from your post that I wanted to take out of context, and I will do so again if needed. ) And by the way, plenty of RP justification of a neutral monk. Who says monks can't have a deity by nature? And be neutral? It's RPable. But in the pk/mechanics sense, you do NOT want to fight a neutral monk. It would just be NASTY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f0xx Posted October 15, 2007 Report Share Posted October 15, 2007 RP justification for monks being good/evil is that they must have a force to meditate on Don't blade masters madetiate too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tantangel Posted October 15, 2007 Report Share Posted October 15, 2007 Yeah, they are required to meditate in fact to gain their mana back, but I think what Balinor was trying to say is that Monks are forced to meditate for other means rather than just the mana in RP terms at least. Personally I think it would help it out a little more, unless there was a protection from Neutral spell made to help cut down the damage dealt to people. Then maybe people would start bitching about that spell and how Neutrals have it hard, I'd find it mildly funny to see the bitch posts on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pali Posted October 15, 2007 Report Share Posted October 15, 2007 Monks are... monks. They are a devout religious order. Blademasters are just fighters who've developed their abilities through intense focus and meditation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyzarius Posted October 15, 2007 Report Share Posted October 15, 2007 Illithids can completly END any blademaster, just takes patience and the use of the leech racial ability. Me beating a decked blm with Leech in the pkill logs My example is a decked syndicate blm using a polearm and deathweaver btw. There are some key things you need to do strategically and items that boost this ability (sorry not saying) but its possible and I have done it several times in Savant vs WM battles. Works on Monks too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L-A Posted October 15, 2007 Report Share Posted October 15, 2007 Illithids can completly END any blademaster, just takes patience and the use of the leech racial ability. I see the leech, but I just assumed you were testing it or you found a way to enter combat without getting some kind of blm counter/spell kill/snake speed etc. In the end, your zombies beat him up good - and you just manage to take less damage from redirects than him. Given I can't see the effects of the leech (and it does something I can see by the text, but I'm not sure what..) L-A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister E Posted October 15, 2007 Report Share Posted October 15, 2007 Looks like it drained mana. After the leech all the trips/bashes landed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celerity Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Leech isn't a qskill, so I think we can talk about it. It drains proficiency.... Unless I've completely forgotten Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudder Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 I always thought leech gave you the drained affect. I remember a long time ago a level 12 illithid was running around putting people to sleep and leeching them, apparently back then it was an instant kill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L-A Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Leech isn't a qskill, so I think we can talk about it. It drains proficiency.... Unless I've completely forgotten Drains prof form everything? I would have thought only the spell it took if you were sucessful.... From help leech: Illithids have gained a special skill, in which they wrap their tentacles around the victim's head, and run an electric current through their tentacles, penetrating the skull. Specialized sensors at the tips of the tentacles reads the feedback of the electric currents, and if successful they are able to steal the victim's memory temporarily. The memory is not lost from the victim. However, the shock to the head have a chance of causing disorientation to the victim. With this skill, Illithids can gain temporary proficiency of spells from illusionists, invokers, necromancers, and psionicists. Due to the enormous strain it takes to retain the memory, the Illithid will be drained for a short while after the affects have worn off. Only the more experienced Illithids can use this skill. Though I have never used the skill enough to investigate the effects fully. L_A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudder Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 From help leech: ...spells from illusionists, invokers, necromancers, and psionicists... L_A Wow, what an old helpfile. Even back in the day, 1.0, that was old. It's so old, Psionicists were taken out of the MUD and given back, all while this helpfile remained unchanged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Forsaken Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Wow' date=' what an old helpfile. Even back in the day, 1.0, that was old. It's so old, Psionicists were taken out of the MUD and given back, all while this helpfile remained unchanged.[/quote'] Kinda makes you think....were they ever really gone....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyzarius Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Leech has many effects, one is hysteria, the other is giving the illithid a spell from the victim. The illithid is only drained if they get a spell, but can try to leech a melee opponent just to get the hysteria effect (fry their brains). Notice the difference in hits and diversions to the blm after leech hit and his balance skill begins to fail as well. Shamans can also do this to blm's using mass hysteria, and fear also has similar effects. Its something that many people seem to overlook. As a Shaman I used hysteria on every melee I fought, turning someone who was ripping me apart into someone I could stand around and apply mal's to. The mechanics of the skill, how to boost or resist I will leave shrouded in secrecy though, of course if you roll an illithid you can figure it out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister E Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Now I want an illithid shaman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roykagh Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Leech has many effects, one is hysteria, the other is giving the illithid a spell from the victim. The illithid is only drained if they get a spell, but can try to leech a melee opponent just to get the hysteria effect (fry their brains). Notice the difference in hits and diversions to the blm after leech hit and his balance skill begins to fail as well. Shamans can also do this to blm's using mass hysteria, and fear also has similar effects. Its something that many people seem to overlook. As a Shaman I used hysteria on every melee I fought, turning someone who was ripping me apart into someone I could stand around and apply mal's to. The mechanics of the skill, how to boost or resist I will leave shrouded in secrecy though, of course if you roll an illithid you can figure it out And just incase anybody doesn't believe the truth in what Kyzarius posted, you might want to see this. :eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evangelion Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 That's a bad example. I didn't have sanctuary and I was dual wielding. That's an example of getting raped, not an example of how leech changes combat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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