AC vs. hit/dam roll

[killalou]

I have a question about AC that has been bugging me for a while. I think I understand hit roll vs. AC. The higher the AC someone has, the higher hitroll you need to get pass their class defenses and the annoying "miss". But what about dam roll? Lets say Person X has -181 AC across the board and you do the standard devastates/decimates through sanc. In my experience I have noticed that if Person Y has -400 or so AC you then start to do "wounds" or some lesser verb damage. Does this mean you have to crank up your dam roll to get back to doing decimates/devastates? If so is there a good general model that someone has for the needed hit/dam vs. AC?

[f0xx]

You are forgetting the damage of the weapon itself....

[Raargant]

You are forgetting the damage of the weapon itself....

Yup. And there are other factors as well, such as level of mastery of enhanced damage, or anatomy for monks/blademasters, or spells such as protection, sanctuary, etc. etc. etc.

Damroll adds to your damage, true, but it is just one of many factors that affects how much damage you can actually pump. One of the reasons why, for the most part, hitroll>damroll.

[Zrothum]

I was always under the assumption that damroll was the principle factor of your weapon rolling for max damage.

[Grishnak]

While I agree that hitroll is, to a large extent, more important than damroll for a melee I would also recommend you take the same weapon and go fight something while you have 20ish damroll then fight the same thing again with 50ish.

Tell me damroll isn't important after you do that. It helps out alot. And to answer the original question: AC does decrease damage taken even when they do hit. Damroll will help increase that damage so it's still a large amount after the cut down.

[Aeva]

just aim for 50/50 and be done with it

[killalou]

just aim for 50/50 and be done with it

Yeah but that leaves you with next to no saves...unless you grab a few key UNIQUE pieces.

[killalou]

Yup. And there are other factors as well, such as level of mastery of enhanced damage, or anatomy for monks/blademasters, or spells such as protection, sanctuary, etc. etc. etc.

Damroll adds to your damage, true, but it is just one of many factors that affects how much damage you can actually pump. One of the reasons why, for the most part, hitroll>damroll.

A counted sanc in. Neglecting enchance damage and support spells/skills, what is the relationship to the damage you are outputting vs. your opponents AC? I.E. what can i do to raise my "wounds" through sanc vs. a - 400 AC opponent to "decimates/devastates".

[The Forsaken]

Depending on the class, get a higher average damage weapon or raise your damage roll.

[Grishnak]

Higher average damage weapon, higher damroll

Different damage type weapon is another choice, depending on their race/eq/class: Using non-mundane weapons usually can result in higher damage because armors have less magic AC and there are less easy access mitigators (ie: stone skin for mundanes).

Other things that will help output more damage (not necessarily a higher damage noun): Use a more offensive weapon or a weapon your enemy doesn't know (you will hit more often), raise hitroll (same reason), blind them, find ways to dispel protectives, use detect magic and wait til protections drop to lay the smack down.

[Raargant]

A counted sanc in. Neglecting enchance damage and support spells/skills' date=' what is the relationship to the damage you are outputting vs. your opponents AC? I.E. what can i do to raise my "wounds" through sanc vs. a - 400 AC opponent to "decimates/devastates".[/quote']

Remember, it doesn't matter how much damage you do per hit; it matters how much damage you do per round. Don't worry about how hard each hit is; worry about how fast the guy's total health is dropping (respective to your own, of course). I think you're getting a bit hung up on the damage per hit deal.

With that being said, Grishnak has esentially summarized several ways to pump your damage per shot. Just remember that two wounds is better than one decimate/devastate.

[kahlos]

Uber HR/DR + Attrition is the way to go. Stuff AC I say. (Although I know if I start using armor / shield / stone skin etc pills I'd be better. )

[Questioner]

I would personally work towards getting my hit and dam roll as high as possible. Hit roll being higher than damroll. And if you have a vuln, try and cover it with some key equipment. Although, nowadays, it is so hard for me to keep my equipment due to a lack in eptitude that I just try and focus on hit/dam. Ac comes as an extra bonus.

[English lad]

Don't try so hard to get exact numbers as well. Higher hit roll/dam roll is better (no Sh*t! , higher av damage weapon is better - lower AC defends better - you don't need to work out the exact figures - this is not a number crunching game, and shouldn't even really be a powergaming culture either - Theres enough of that out there in the WoW of the world.

[Kyzarius]

Enlgish...close parens!!!

Hit/Dam/saves for melee

hp/ac/saves for casters

hp/ac for communers.

[Aulian]

Uber HR/DR + Attrition is the way to go. Stuff AC I say. (Although I know if I start using armor / shield / stone skin etc pills I'd be better. )

Kidding Right? AC helps so much. On Dumela I have an ac over -400. It helps so much with bash lock, just ask Masokant and size there = tiny to HUGE.

AC helps a bit more then you think. Much more.

Enlgish...close parens!!!

Hit/Dam/saves for melee

hp/ac/saves for casters

hp/ac for communers.

Pretty good idea of what you should have for what. Obviously depending on what sort of communer youy have. Aka - A combat cleric will look for melee eq as will a druid depending on teh style of play.

[Kyzarius]

Pretty good idea of what you should have for what. Obviously depending on what sort of communer youy have. Aka - A combat cleric will look for melee eq as will a druid depending on teh style of play.

Absolutly true, I was speaking more in general terms. My necros, for example, are hp/LUCK/saves (letting ac be what it will be) for reasons that most people despise.

[Kinicky]

My shamans are usually hp/luck/saves and I just make sure my AC is around -300

[Celerity]

Luck is one of the easiest, most useful, and perhaps most overlooked defenses in the game.

Of course, your gear should be 'geared' for who you will fight. AC is almost useless (or even detrimental) against the standard mage and many communers. Likewise, saves are useless against melees and some hybrids.

[Grumpy]

Which is why Hit/Dam for melee & hp/luck/+lvl for pure caster is superior since it is useful against everyone.

[Celerity]

Maybe in a general sense, but I think that people fight a much less variety of opponents then they might think.

For example, if you are a playing a WM warrior, you might spend most of your time fighting necros and invokers. In that case, the eq slots used to boost HIT are mostly wasted. HIT should be sacrificed for mental and some afflicitive saves in this case.

Likewise, HP gear on a caster is wasted against a shaman.

[Lexi]

Still, high saves can totally gimp caster/communer opponents. There's no armor that's equally useful against melees as high AC doesn't even really compare.

[Pali]

Still' date=' high saves can totally gimp caster/communer opponents. There's no armor that's equally useful against melees as high AC doesn't even really compare.[/quote']

Try saying that when you're fighting an invoker who's got -500ac and 900 hp.