We are going into a serious recession.

[Evangelion]

Goldbond, let the poor horse rest in peace.

Until you show me the following:

1) Your birth certificate

2) Your certification as a financial adviser

AND

3) Your degree in economics

I continue to call bull****.

[Aulian]

Lol I've done a total of 10 years eco study - 6 years of highschool eco and 4 years of uni eco but Im just going to let you americans argue it out.

[a-guitarist]

really? because that's just a hyperinflationary recession/depression. and it's something that even PhD's are arguing will happen or if we're going to face a deflationary scenario. where did you get your little bachelor's from again?

Well, that's what I came here to post. For every 10 economists saying one thing, there are 10 saying another. And for every 20 saying different things, there are 40 arm chair experts preaching their advice.

Until you tell me where you got your economics degree, Gold, then I'm gonna take the advice of someone that actually graduated with a degree. Call me crazy... just what I'll do.

And try to chill on the name calling. WC started it, yeah, but you're continuing it... everyone needs to take a pill and relax. In through the nose, out through the mouth. Blue, peaceful thoughts. Ahhhhhhhhhh.... Ooooommmmmmmm....

Generally speaking... this whole "EVERYBODY PANIC! THE WORLD IS NIGH!" Crap is getting old. I understand the economy is taking to some changes, but we've been riding high for awhile (in the grand scheme of things, calm down Bush Haters, I'm on your side), but why are all recession's bad? Just because some idiot can't drive his ricer sports car with the spoiler like a freaking idiot anymore, and a few more people are going to have to worry about "Gee, do I buy Milk today, or do I buy a pack of smokes? I just can't figure this out..." isn't really a big deal.

I will not have a hard to finding a job. I'll have a hard time finding a job that isn't something I'll hate. Because I'm a better, harder working than 90% of the world out there... some kid thinks he's gonna keep his starbuck's job when he's calling in every other week, and constantly late talking about all the pot he smoked on the weekend and then how many girls he thinks he hooked up with? Well, that, or I'll get his hours when the manager looks at me with my head down about my personal life, talking to the customer instead of at them, and being a damned good employee.

But all in all, I don't have a degree, so I only pretend to understand the workings of the dollar. So sue me. I give people like my brother a reason to have a job.

a-g

[WarriorCleric]

really? because that's just a hyperinflationary recession/depression. and it's something that even PhD's are arguing will happen or if we're going to face a deflationary scenario. where did you get your little bachelor's from again?

Yes, the PhD's are arguing if it will or won't happen... Pretty much my point. There is no certain course of action here, everyone thinks they know but try to find even wide spread agreement between everyone, it won't happen. And if nothing is certain, when has running around like a chicken with your head cutoff been beneficial? Also, If I were going to argue Hyperinflation, I would have said it, and something along the lines of 'and spend all you can.'

I got my little degree from a local community college, I got my big degree from the University on the other side of the state. But either way, I'm pretty sure that I learned more than the people who just barely skirtted by when studying at an Ivy League.

Hands down, if everyone in the country followed your advice we would "suffer" even worse than we might be a year from now. But I'll tell you what, it's clear we are not going to be in agreement on this so you keep eating your pasta and flavored water, and I'll keep eating full, flavorful meals, and we'll see who has a better time in the next five years. If you think that post asshatted myself, then you've not read my previous posts.

champ

Cupcake, use cupcake next time.

WC

[samag08]

"The sky is falling, The sky is falling!" ~ Chicken Little.

Things really good? - No

Things really bad? - No

Things mediocre? - BINGO!

Again smart practices pay of even in slowed markets. Everyone is so used to the "Instant coffee, Microwave meals, I want it NOW mentality." Now we, as Americans actually have to stop being idiots and start educating ourselves about finance. And please spare me the "Government should step in and help us." act. They are not your mommy and daddy. You make your own bed, you sleep in it! Government bailouts make me pretty sick actually. Those are MY tax dollars going to help some damned fool who probably is too ignorant to spend a small amount of time to sit down and see what he/she can really afford. Be different if taxes were optional but they are not, so those people who laugh about collecting free government money piss me off. In my eyes they are STEALING from myself and our country, and our future generations. Whew! Had to vent that.

The best thing for folks to do nowadays has been repeated til the cows come home. No debt, show up for work(every day, regardless). Just this past Friday I cracked a molar tooth almost completely in half, exposed nerve and all, no dentists til Tuesday, guess what, still went to work, still going to work Monday also. BTW, as far as stocks go, stick to dollar cost averaging. I picked 4 new funds from T ROWE PRICE for the wife and I's ROTH IRA's. So far we've deposited about $4800.00 since Jan. 1 and have profited roughly $600.00. Dollar cost averaging is the only proven way to "buy low and sell high", because you snap up more shares of a good fund when it is low and cheap and less when the market hype has it jumping upwards. I just have the money systematically withdraw from my checking account on a weekly basis. If Warren Buffet(Americas rightest man now, ahead of Gates) has done this his entire life, I think I trust him.

[goldbond]

degrees mean sh#t. anyone who knows anything knows that people who see through the maze are introverts who focus on a problem in singular fashion without the influence of either academia or popular opinion. that could either be a non-teaching PhD in a shack, the weird guy down your street, or anyone else.

[Pali]

Yeah, there's no point in actually learning about a subject before you start expressing opinions on it, right?

[goldbond]

if you say so. good luck@that. what i said was that introverts who focus on a problem are the ones that actually make innovation happen. none of that requires school. you're the one who made the false inference. next.

[Pali]

I agree that schooling is not required for one to have an informed opinion on a subject (I've taken nothing but very basic classes in astronomy and biology, but because of other hobbies I've had to learn a fair bit about them on my own). However, I do NOT agree that someone who has no credentials regarding a very complex subject (such as economics) is someone whose words should be taken at the same face value as those of someone who has those credentials, because those credentials mean that one can be fairly certain that this person has studied the topic extensively and examined a wide range of thought regarding it... in other words, though I know quite a bit of astronomy and biology, I'll still take the thoughts of an astronomer or biologist over mine in their respective fields.

[mya]

Things are not so well in Europe.

Some countries have already manifestations about the price of Gas.

And this is a serious problem, as new Gas prices prevents a lot of company profits making the less stable companies in a very bad situation.

Just two days ago i saw something i thought i would never see, a supermarket rationate the number of Rice you could buy. 10 kg/person.

If oil prices keep increasing Europe goes down with US.

I for myself am converting my personal savings into gold coins.

If worst comes along, at least i will be able to buy food.

[Kyzarius]

heh, I am in a position where my finger is literally on the pulse of the US trucking industry. We manage freight for dozens of distributors..

Its going to get reeeealll expensive to buy anything soon. If nothing changes in the current rises in cost.

[a-guitarist]

if you say so. good luck@that. what i said was that introverts who focus on a problem are the ones that actually make innovation happen. none of that requires school. you're the one who made the false inference. next.

I'll feed the troll... It's a little more than Supply and Demand. So, since you've got your vast knowledge in economics from the school of common sense... Tell me the difference between environmental and ecological economics? (No points for opening a new browser and slamming wikipedia), How about how Unions in some cases hurt the company more than they help, which means they hurt the employee's? (Yes, some unions were/are good.) What are your thoughts on Health care and Tort Reform (near and dear to my heart right now)? I mean... sure, there are too many damned lawsuits, and any shmuck realizes that because some jagoff is suing someone over nothing it's gonna hurt everyone's chances... but just because you realize it does NOT mean you know WHY it will. And the key to fixing the problem is not just knowing it will happen, but knowing why.

I see people debate this flawed argument all the time. Sure, you don't have to be educated to understand something. But you will not know as much as someone that went to a university/technical school/ect. and put the time in. Any idiot rich kid can get into a school, join a frat, and drink away his gpa and still graduate... they didn't learn anything. Those are the people you're running into. Pali is right, it's easy to know a lot about something your passionate about and not formally educated in. But I'd put my stock into someone that god off their *** and put the time in to learn about everything involved in the subject. I have an extensive knowledge on mental illnesses and treatments... but I don't have a degree that "doesn't mean ****". Who is the expert? Me, or the doctor?

Oh, and to answer my own questions... I don't have a freaking idea. As these are just things I hear WC bitch about on a daily basis. But, you know, I understand enough about them to follow what he's saying, most of the time. Until he starts speaking formulae and calculus... heh.

Go ahead and say how degrees mean ****. Go ahead and preach how they're worthless in today's society. Some are... MBA? Right, you've learned a lot there. But, what degrees mean to most businesses is, "This kid put in the time to get to this job." it doesn't mean, "This kid is an expert in his field." Are you an expert in your field with a bachelors in Math? Nope. Are you an expert in your field with a masters in Math? Nope, but you can now teach high school. What about a PhD? Yeah, now you're an expert. And guess what... you're probably making more than that 40k that teachers make.

Could you have learned that much without a degree and college education? Hell yeah you could. Would you have a job anywhere? Nope. Why? Cause 200 other people put in the time to get that meaningless piece of paper.

I'm gonna have a bitch of a time finding a job with health insurance. Why? I'm a college drop out. Am I going to cry about injustices of the system? Nope. I know exactly what is needed to better my chances of getting a good job, and I didn't do any of those. And don't get me started on Socialized Health Care (Yeah, I said socialized. Oh, I'm not a fan of it.)

a-g

[Kyzarius]

Degrees arent meaningless, however just not having a degree in a particular field doesnt mean someone who has it knows more by default, thats an ignorant conclusion.

I dont have a degree. I went to school for five years but never completed any one program.

I saw an opportunity in a buisness market trained myself on what I needed to know worked my *** off in the chosen field for five years, started my own buisness, capitalized on contacts and expert knowledge and am quite succesful in my chosen field, heck I am 27 with a sep-ira bulging on 20k already....my company "feeds" about fifteen families and banks a rather nice piece of profit each month.

I spend most of my time correcting the mistakes those "fresh college grads" make logistically because they have no clue what they are doing.

What it all breaks down to is experience is worth much more than JUST degree. A degree helps, but in the long run it is what you do with the experiences you encounter in life that shapes how effective you are in any field.

[KRins]

True story...but that I R SMART piece of paper sure does swing some doors open a lot faster. Speaking from a degree-holding, rather minimal experience standpoint. I seem to get a lot of interviews that people who don't have degrees but have experience don't...but I also seem to get rejected pretty frequently while someone with experience (though they generally have a degree too, maybe not from a top flight school but a degree nonetheless.) gets the job. Obviously a combination of the two would be best...but I would trade 4 years of hands-on for my degree sometimes. The only bonus I feel that a degree holder has over a non-degree holder other than the piece of paper is a more intimate knowledge of cutting edge concepts in the field. I know I sometimes explain a newer concept to a room of workers who have been doing their job a certain way for umpteen years and I just get the blank stare of "huh?"

[Raargant]

I dislike anecdotes and prefer hard data. There are exceptions to every rule, but that doesn't negate the rule itself. And what is the rule?

Seems pretty clear to me.

Of course, as I said, there are always exceptions to the rule. Many people, in fact, feel that they are exceptions. You may be one of them. You may not be. But saying that higher education/diploma is worthless, well...the graph speaks for itself.

[Kyzarius]

True story...but that I R SMART piece of paper sure does swing some doors open a lot faster. Speaking from a degree-holding' date=' rather minimal experience standpoint. I seem to get a lot of interviews that people who don't have degrees but have experience don't...but I also seem to get rejected pretty frequently while someone with experience (though they generally have a degree too, maybe not from a top flight school but a degree nonetheless.) gets the job. Obviously a combination of the two would be best...but I would trade 4 years of hands-on for my degree sometimes. The only bonus I feel that a degree holder has over a non-degree holder other than the piece of paper is a more intimate knowledge of cutting edge concepts in the field. I know I sometimes explain a newer concept to a room of workers who have been doing their job a certain way for umpteen years and I just get the blank stare of "huh?"[/quote']

yeah that last part is funny...I run into the same all the time, you breach a new method or process for accomplishing something and the monetary savings and efficency is so obvious that a 4 year old can see that its a better course yet....people tend to stick their heads in the sand and chant "we fear change"

[Kyzarius]

I dislike anecdotes and prefer hard data. There are exceptions to every rule, but that doesn't negate the rule itself. And what is the rule?

Seems pretty clear to me.

Of course, as I said, there are always exceptions to the rule. Many people, in fact, feel that they are exceptions. You may be one of them. You may not be. But saying that higher education/diploma is worthless, well...the graph speaks for itself.

nice graph, thats pretty cool, My take home after taxes is ~1500 a week, so I am netting what the median for doctorates is grossing according to your data

[Raargant]

So you're ahead of the curve. Want a cookie?

[BigPapa]

What child support?

No monsterous health insurance costs for a family?

No 401k?

No extra long and short term disability insurance, life insurance, no Pact monies for the trucking company?

Geez, I could use a cookie. I make next to nothing after paying all that!

DOH!

[Imoutgoodbye]

What child support?

No monsterous health insurance costs for a family?

No 401k?

No extra long and short term disability insurance, life insurance, no Pact monies for the trucking company?

Geez, I could use a cookie. I make next to nothing after paying all that!

DOH!

Have a cookie!

I make about $550 every TWO weeks after taxes, but that's because I started claiming two dependants even though technically I will only have one this year. So, according to Raargant there, I make less weekly than someone who doesn't even have a high school diploma, yet I have one....not that it ever meant anything to me....I barely had to put forth effort....people are retarded....wait....that means retarded people make more money than me...

I'll take that cookie back...thank you!

[Raargant]

I'm pretty sure the graph is for pre-tax dollars.

[Guest Valganti]

I just don't quite get how we still believe capitalism is the best course for managing a 6.5billion person economy. We have banks lending governments money, governments lending banks money, governments lending governments money, banks lending banks money.............

Seems to me it's all the same money and they're only creating money out of thin air by assigning interest rates. I've taken my fair share of economics courses, but I'm deffinately anti-capitalism.

[KRins]

You haven't noticed that we have a deficit of several TRILLION dollars? You think there is a TRILLION dollars in existance...I don't. Notice: Dollars...not all flavors of monies. The governments and banks of the world are all about making up imaginary money. I bet when they sit down at lunch they gripe about how that old hag from billing owes so and so a half trillion imaginary dollars. Even considering a trillion dollars makes me happy. I better get going to BJJ class so I can take an involuntary nap and dream of MUH TRILLIONZ!!!!

[Pali]

Uh, yes, there are many trillions of dollars in existence. If the average American has $3,000, that's a trillion right there when all Americans are counted up.

[Ex-D&Der]

I'm surprised doctorates make more than professionals. I would have thought all the doctors, lawyers, engineers and MBAs in there would have made more than college professors. But there must be some highly paid people in business with PhDs to account for that I suppose.