Gotta agree. I've never liked how monks rely so completely on lagging their target to death. I'm not really sure how to change them to fix this though.
Monks.
For the OP, a quick query. What was the weapon/shield combo you were using? I have rarely/never seen a monk kill a fully prepared and protected communer in 8-10 rounds, unless the monk was decked to hell, AND was hitting chakeras like a woodchucker gobbling wood.
in theory it would be pretty easy to give this notion a whirl on test port, especially if any equipment is available on test. one guy plays decked monk, the other guy plays communer and mage with all protections up. monk player sees if he can bolt/thrash/trip communer/mage without him getting one command in before he's locked/dead. do it over and over, count the times communer/mage couldn't get one command in, and how many times the game mechanics allowed the communer/mage to flee if he had a high wimpy set.
maybe do another series where communer/mage didnt have protective shield up and the monk only had to thrash/trip and see how many times the guy died without a single command or wasnt allowed to flee through wimpy.
so if it does turn out through many fight tests like this after tallying it up that monks can do this, then remove air thrash lag or reduce it to one round.
Even if monks can laglock, I do not see a problem with this.
The problem is not about monks being able to laglock, they SHOULD be able to do it, the thing is, they should not be able to do it so easily...
For the OP' date=' a quick query. What was the weapon/shield combo you were using? I have rarely/never seen a monk kill a fully prepared and protected communer in 8-10 rounds, unless the monk was decked to hell, AND was hitting chakeras like a woodchucker gobbling wood.[/quote']
I was prepared to go fight another class, and was actually on my way to them when monk caught me. I was using my holy hands along with a noremove shield.
Also, this is not the first time this has happened to me. Aokami pulled the same thing off a few different times when I was playing Felhara, as did Atsul(a).
In fact, I would go so far as to say that in my experience fighting monks at pinn, around half the fights have gone the path of chii bolt, air thrash, trip, trip, trip until dead.
Aokami wasn't even a barb was he? Now a barb monk is sick beyond the legal limit.
In fact' date=' I would go so far as to say that in my experience fighting monks at pinn, around half the fights have gone the path of chii bolt, air thrash, trip, trip, trip until dead.[/quote']
Exactly. The problem as I see it is that monks are basically designed so that against communers/casters, this is their game plan and that's it. Buddha, frankly, is useless (if any current monk player wants to correct me they may, but my monks NEVER had use for it). It is basically the same way a warrior fights a rogue... bash bash bash. I'd love for things to be different for both, for there to be some actual strategy to them... I'm just lacking ideas that aren't major remakes of the classes.
I agree that a major overhaul of the class would be needed to correct this issue. And, to be honest, I'd kind of like to do one. First things first, though.
Know what's disconcerting? All this talk of how easy it is to own stuff with a monk, and I can't do anything with a fully trained one. I hate my life.
Know what's disconcerting? All this talk of how easy it is to own stuff with a monk' date=' and I can't do anything with a fully trained one. I hate my life.[/quote']
Lol. It's all about the right equipment mixed with the right stance.
Which funnily enough, is what they say about being hip-hop.
Dey
Well, I think its very important to note 2 things specific to Montahg; firstly, you managed to flee (and cast a spell?), at which point you were tripped again. It was not a pure laglock, but mostly one that was made capable by player error (apologize if that sounds harsh). Secondly, the monk you fought was better prepared than most monks will be, and you were not prepared for the monk (and still not a pure laglock).
Some other points...Air thrash only lags one round, and it is difficult (I have played a few monks, and since the changes, in my many, many pks I haven't had more than 2 pure lag locks against a flying opponent. And one of those sanc fell.) In fact, I have even been killed by a communer (gasp) and almost killed by an invoker (double gasp).
Unfortunately, the tone of this post seems somewhat defensive; I simply think that painting the idea of pking or a pure lag lock with a monk as idea is a heinous error.
Ok random idea.
What if monk Bolt did not "dispel" protective shield, but cracked it.
Alowing chakeras damage and black dragons, but no lag.
They can still lag from trips/airtrash.
Ok random idea.
What if monk Bolt did not "dispel" protective shield, but cracked it.
Alowing chakeras damage and black dragons, but no lag.
They can still lag from trips/airtrash.
It takes 6 combat rounds to store a chi bolt, SIX! The cost of time in battle is quite steep, in six combat rounds your opponent can be all over you.
I think the chii-bolt skill combo gives monks teeth they need.
66% of my player deaths (since coming back, over multiple characters) have come from monk laglocks. I consider myself one of the most paranoid players here, being on alert at all times. I was as prepared as much as a mage can be (both battlemage and invoker), and got corn-holed. Do I consider it overpowered? Nope. Sometimes it comes down to connection speed, and that all-important first attack. Monks are tricky to play fully.
Now, I must say, if you're spending 6 rounds of combat to store a bolt, you could be doing something else. It's been so long since I played a monk (2.0).
I agree that a major overhaul of the class would be needed to correct this issue. And' date=' to be honest, I'd kind of like to do one. First things first, though.[/quote']
WHAT?! How come when I complained about it, it was ignored. In this situation it seems like the communer died within only a few trips (my guess is that his eq wasn't up to par). In my situation there was much less speculation as I also provided half of the log, a barbarian monk tripped me for **over sixty rounds ** that's thirty trips and I was unable to enter a single command as a human, not even a single failed flee. The damage he was doing were injures compared to mine but he caught me without sanctuary. His sanctuary even failed during combat and he had enough time to go back into sanc (provided it was an in-battle consumable) and continue tripping.
Another thing that occured to me twice alone as well as to a couple other good players that I never brought to the attention of the imms was the Vampires ability to lag as well in a certain place. Here we were doing very weak damage to each other but that **** ability was enough to give him the slight edge in damage and keep me in the battle for a ridiculous amount of rounds. Not to mention I was the most melee capable class i.e. a warrior wielding a weapon he does not not know **and **has a vuln to. Additionally I was wearing his godly set which I just took from him probably ten minutes earlier. If someone doesn't see what's wrong with this picture...
I see whats wrong with that picture..
Play a vampire. That lag is not NEARLY as reliable as you make out.
Aint that the truth. I've been lag locked once by a Monk, and mostly because I screwed up and saw him attack my Cabal, I came for him and he caught me just outside Emerald in a spam directly to my Cabal so I still had about 13 rooms or so to go before I was AT my Cabal. I almost killed him, completely spelled up and more protected than OJ Simpson at his first trials and still died because of my commands going through the last few rounds before I died. If it hadn't been for my movements, had I gotten in one spell off that was offensive I would've won the battle, but he had managed an almost perfect lag lock. Same monk nearly got me again one day when I had a shoddy connection and I disconnected, when I came back he had managed to flee and come back and at least let me have that. Think it is a tad bit harsh to end up getting spanked and not be able to do anything about it, about the closest you can come to winning is if you're more than prepared for the person and if you manage to get off that offensive spell in first you'll probably win.
As for the storing of a chii bolt, most monks wont be storing it in the middle of battle, they most always end up storing it up for a while because they were planning on it to begin with. Not sure if there's a timer on having it stored or not, but if not, maybe they should have a timer, level 1 chii bolt lasts like 12 hours, chii 2 is 6 and chii 3 is only 3 ticks in which case if you don't unleash it in that time they lose all focus of it and have to start anew.
It works exactly like that actually.