Ask Myrek

[Deykari]

At the end of the day, this MUD is a game with rules state that full looting is 100% legal, that multikilling (within reason) is 100% legal, and that ganging (within reason) is 100% legal.

No matter WHAT anybody (barring immortals) says or does, if the above is legal, then it will happen. Why? Because people come here to play a game and play it in the way that is most fun for them, within the constraints of the rules. There are people with different mindsets as to what is 'classy and sportsmanlike' and different approaches to the MUD that will tackle these issues differently.

These debates will not change anything, and anyone who thinks telling people to stop full-looting and multi-killing because it drives newbies away will are wrong. If full looting is legal, and it gives satisfaction/joy/advantage to a player, then people WILL do it because not everyone is here to have a nice, loving fair game.

It's just like most online FPS games. Take spawn-camping. Is it legal? Yes. Is it 'classy'? Most would say no. Some people do it anyway though, because they get their kicks out of having a nice score and getting a few easy kills, which is no bad thing for some and like the next holocaust for others.

Now with FL, not only is the price of death much greater here than it is in an FPS game, but the vast majority of players can congregate here and vent when something they disagree with happens. It is a smaller, more tightly knit community where everything is a lot more 'personal' and that is why we have all these debates and arguments that just get old.

I have no qualms against anybody doing anything that is within the rules of the MUD. No player should be looked down upon as 'unclassy', an '*sshat' or anything else, simply because they are playing how is fun for them provided it is legal, and if that sort of playing causes great distress to the rest of the playerbase, shouldn't that suggest the RULES are the problem, not the PLAYER?

I think we have an excellent MUD system here that many people enjoy, but the rules themselves are catered towards 'hardcore' players, which is why I think a lot of people get frustrated. Yet they love the MUD system so much, they don't want to leave - and thus end up playing the MUD frustrated with how the rules allow them to be full-looted, multikilled within reason, etc.

This is just me (trying) to give some sort of neutral opinion. Nothing about my own playstyle or the like in there. I'm not saying there IS anything wrong with the rules either.

Dey

[-red-]

I haven't wanted to become involved in the growing number of negative threads of this nature, but the recent fascination with all of this - and subsequently the opinions being thrown around - has inspired me to comment.

I've been playing here for three years or more, and anyone who knows me will tell you I'm always the one being kicked around, multied, full looted and generally placed in the 'hopeless newb' category. And I'm totally ok with it, for the most part. I don't complain except to friends to blow off steam, and in a lot of cases I agree with the points some of these 'veteran' players are making.

However, in my humble and generally useless opinion (after all, opinions are like *******s, are they not?) there's the proverbial line that's been crossed.

Players like to use a multitude of excuses they wouldn't use in other cases to justify actions that I feel are detrimental to the progress of the MUD, and are essentially rude and uncaring toward their fellow player.

Toughen up, you say. Several players comment that this is only a game, but a game we play for enjoyment. If it's only a game, why multikill, full looted and over-all grief a player? This hardly makes it fun, except of course for the person doing it. There are those, certainly, to whome this happens and they got over this. This is not the majority, as far as I can tell (the threads croppingup recently give testament to this.)

Others might claim that their RP dictates this sort of behavior, and action in another fashion is OOC. The fact of the matter is, to have a game run smoothly there are some things - and in my estimation, courteous play and guidelines are part of this bracket - that must remain and operate OOC.

Every month a new thread opens directing us to vote on TMS, to draw in new players. However, our behavior is counter-productive to admitting new players with this 'harden up or get the f- out' mentality a lot of us have adopted. Probably because we were treated the same. Reminds me of the red headed step child who beats his children because pappa did it to him.

Then there are those who say 'if they can't hash it, they shouldn't be here.' I find this curious when on the one hand we constantly barrage people with threads to vote and then greet them with comments like these.

There's a rift here that needs to be addressed, I feel; the veteran players who only seem to want veteran players to play here (which would certainly decrease the playerbase, and I don't think they realize this is what they're advocating), and those interested in some new blood to roll up in the ranks. Then there's the mysterious gray who aren't sure what they want. These are the vocal ones, I think.

I close with a plea for understanding; we don't all learn like you do. That's not the way learning works. I've tried many times to learn to PK, and it's been an INCREDIBLY slow process, not because of the playerbase but because of my own learning deficiency (you think I want to play Heralds all the time?) There needs to be some sort of compromise from the hard-liners in BOTH camps, and a compromise the IMMS can't necessarily make with such a decisive split.

Finally, please don't misunderstand the tone or intent of this post. This is not an attack, not an accusation but a post written in genuine concern for a place I've spent a great deal of time and invested so much in. All in all, this is again one player's opinion, and should be regarded as such.

[a-guitarist]

*golf clap* Couldn't have said it better myself.

a-g

[Kyzarius]

Does the phrase "obnoxius' date=' asinine, and generally useless" mean anything to you?[/quote']

beat me to it.

Every month a new thread opens directing us to vote on TMS, to draw in new players. However, our behavior is counter-productive to admitting new players with this 'harden up or get the f- out' mentality a lot of us have adopted. Probably because we were treated the same. Reminds me of the red headed step child who beats his children because pappa did it to him.

this right here, I believe sums up the entire problem in a nutshell.

[The Professor]

You know the funny thing about opinions?

They ARE like ***holes, most people only ever care about their own, we all have them and they all stink, if you have seen one....you have seen them all....and the list could keep on going.....but then.....that would be rather pointless right?

My thoughts.....exactly.....

This is not directed at anyone, I just read a post earlier that talked about opinions like *******s and I concur with that...

ROFLMAO!

[mya]

Myrek has never met a player but Myrek is sure that most players are pretentious and full of crap.

Myrek is sure

full of crap.

..

[Deykari]

I haven't wanted to become involved in the growing number of negative threads of this nature, but the recent fascination with all of this - and subsequently the opinions being thrown around - has inspired me to comment.

I've been playing here for three years or more, and anyone who knows me will tell you I'm always the one being kicked around, multied, full looted and generally placed in the 'hopeless newb' category. And I'm totally ok with it, for the most part. I don't complain except to friends to blow off steam, and in a lot of cases I agree with the points some of these 'veteran' players are making.

However, in my humble and generally useless opinion (after all, opinions are like *******s, are they not?) there's the proverbial line that's been crossed.

Players like to use a multitude of excuses they wouldn't use in other cases to justify actions that I feel are detrimental to the progress of the MUD, and are essentially rude and uncaring toward their fellow player.

Toughen up, you say. Several players comment that this is only a game, but a game we play for enjoyment. If it's only a game, why multikill, full looted and over-all grief a player? This hardly makes it fun, except of course for the person doing it. There are those, certainly, to whome this happens and they got over this. This is not the majority, as far as I can tell (the threads croppingup recently give testament to this.)

Others might claim that their RP dictates this sort of behavior, and action in another fashion is OOC. The fact of the matter is, to have a game run smoothly there are some things - and in my estimation, courteous play and guidelines are part of this bracket - that must remain and operate OOC.

Every month a new thread opens directing us to vote on TMS, to draw in new players. However, our behavior is counter-productive to admitting new players with this 'harden up or get the f- out' mentality a lot of us have adopted. Probably because we were treated the same. Reminds me of the red headed step child who beats his children because pappa did it to him.

Then there are those who say 'if they can't hash it, they shouldn't be here.' I find this curious when on the one hand we constantly barrage people with threads to vote and then greet them with comments like these.

There's a rift here that needs to be addressed, I feel; the veteran players who only seem to want veteran players to play here (which would certainly decrease the playerbase, and I don't think they realize this is what they're advocating), and those interested in some new blood to roll up in the ranks. Then there's the mysterious gray who aren't sure what they want. These are the vocal ones, I think.

I close with a plea for understanding; we don't all learn like you do. That's not the way learning works. I've tried many times to learn to PK, and it's been an INCREDIBLY slow process, not because of the playerbase but because of my own learning deficiency (you think I want to play Heralds all the time?) There needs to be some sort of compromise from the hard-liners in BOTH camps, and a compromise the IMMS can't necessarily make with such a decisive split.

Finally, please don't misunderstand the tone or intent of this post. This is not an attack, not an accusation but a post written in genuine concern for a place I've spent a great deal of time and invested so much in. All in all, this is again one player's opinion, and should be regarded as such.

That's all well and good, and incase you were referring to my post, I wasn't trying to adopt the "harden up or go" attitude.

Thing is though, if the rules allow play that is deemed 'unclassy' then it will happen, regardless of how much you plea. It's human nature - there are the folk that will disobey the rules and get banned, the folk that play within the rules and feel they are being fair because they are within the rules, and the folk that play within the rules but also live by some sort of ‘code of honour’. Only the former are the ‘bad’ players – the latter two are both not doing anything wrong. Just that different people have their own personal codes of conduct which clash.

Sure, you may not like it if someone kills you and full loots you twice in one day. Sure, they might be an “*sshat” because of it. Like I said, it’s just human nature- not everybody is going to play like you do, to your code of honour and conduct. I can bet, however, that a lot of these players aren’t anarchists. Just because they may not play by an honour system doesn’t mean they don’t play by the rules.

In short, the rules in place facilitate the in-game behaviour that so many of you do not like. Pleading is all well and good, but it’s not going to work for the most part. If the mayor of a city declared usage of guns for violence was legal, you’d have a fair amount people running around with rifles shooting people. You’d have the people with their own, different sense of morals, ethics, code of conduct, whatever, that dictates they aren’t going to do that – but at the end of the day, it’s the fault of the law not the shooters, because ideally, if that law was removed, you’d expect the shooters to stop shooting, and those that didn’t would be dealt with.

What am I saying? There IS a rift between the 'hardcore' players and the 'softcore' players, inwhich the softcore do not agree with the hardcore code of conduct even though both codes of conduct are legal.

Sorry for rambling on and on and probably not making much sense, but I can’t seem to explain what I mean. I’m not saying the rules of FL are faulty, I’m just saying that they allow a playing style that many of you deem ‘unclassy’ - so before pinpointing the problem on 'hardcore' players, think about this a bit.

Dey

[Pieman]

They ARE like ***holes' date=' most people only ever care about their own, we all have them and they all stink, if you have seen one....you have seen them all[/quote']

...I'm pretty sure there is a huge difference between Megan Fox's ***hole and Rosie O'Donnell's ***hole...ya know, just for an example.

[Kyzarius]

...I'm pretty sure there is a huge difference between Megan Fox's ***hole and Rosie O'Donnell's ***hole...ya know' date=' just for an example.[/quote']

like the tail pipe of an accura and the tail pipe of a mak-truck..sorry, no more..

[Aulian]

A few things.

1. Red hit the nail on the head.

We have to encourage a learning environment that not only supports bloodshed but also RP. I've had cabal enemies ask me to hold off because they are doing something RP orientated (IC'ly ofcourse) and I've found something else to do. This is an RP mud and sometimes its not all about ME.

If you ever want something to clear that point, the point that this mud is not JUST about what you want, in your mind then make a vampire in Herald. Thats what did it for me.

RP and LEARNING is something that needs to be encouraged.

I dont mean by cheering it on in the forums. But allowing those moments to occur, and allowing yourself to step back and say hey, I could roll this group of three or I can go sit in Emerald and read the forums. Sure rolling is fun but lets let the newer players newb it out a bit.

I can honestly say that I feel someone going out and purposely killing (without real reasons.. And I have had people tell me their real reason is "because I want you to kneel at my feet." or "Im testing you." - never mind the fact that I've never even logged on before at the same time.) Someone while they are talking to someone or trying to DEFINE their OWN CHARACTERS (something by far, not done by many... Morchial do I miss you.) Is in every way counter productive.

OFCOURSE there are times where you have to barge in. But a lot of the times it doesn't have to be run in and dirt.

I think we need to start broadening our horizons.. Thinking how to make this all a bit more indepth instead of shallow. Act as a real person would act (and at times thats run in..) sometimes its strolling in and grinning like a maniac, talking to the bastards having the "tea-party" before you flip the table over and start mashing skulls.

We all need to define who we are. By running around with a [WATCHER] flag is not in any means a personal definition. Its a small branch of who you are, how you react/act and what you want out of life. The only way one can form an identity is by interaction. YOU CANNOT KNOW WHAT A CHARACTER IS ABOUT BY ASSUMING THEY HAVE THIS ALLIANCE AND THATS THAT. You need to interact to share your own personal identity, to know and understand each other and develop the game to its full potential.

This is in my opinion why the age old RP's still stand. AKA "Warmaster vs Savant" rp. too often do you just draw your sword and attack that white flag without considering the possibility of change, change that could easily or perhaps not so easily take place if we all sheathed our swords and argued instead of stabbed and hacked.

I think the first gathering of the Righteous Brotherhood is a very good example of how suddenly people can work together if you get players willing to sit down and sheath their swords.

2. Deykari your signature is awesome.

3. MOP has some very valuable insights at times I find.

PS sorry for the rant. My computer screwed up four times. And this has gotten wilder and wilder from a very well thought out post (trying to remember all I said.)

[Ex-D&Der]

The interesting thing is in terms of the content of the posts I'm usually on the side of those disagreeing with Myrek (which I somehow always felt was a minority of one). But I never found multikilling to be a problem when Myrek played. If it was a problem, it was only in the more recent vintages of the game, with the deeper exploitation of equipment and more sophisticated understanding of game mechanics. But even then it was really of my own making. For instance I took maybe a dozen deaths to a single character across two of my characters. But when I stop and count, only four or so of those deaths were initiated by him. I think it was a case of my not wanting to admit I was beaten. So Myrek is really kind of right.

Somehow I sense that if more people took this rough and tumble attitude toward the MUD, instead of taking eq so seriously, it would be a better place. But I also worry that, like most returning vets, Myrek won't last, or will get discouraged by the new intensity of PK. On the other hand Pali and Layabout haven't gone anywhere, and they still have old-school views of this issue.

The reason we have fewer players is first of all the decline of MUDs generally vs. MMORPGs (MUDs were in their heyday when most of us had 56kbs tops) and second the hyperbolic increase in the learning curve that has come with the nerfing of equipment and increased sophistication of the veteran P-base. I don't think we can really lay it at Myrek's feet.

[Deykari]

If you feel that ‘hardcorism’ is hindering playerbase growth because it’s driving players away, think of it like this:

Imagine you owned a company, and said to your employees, “Hey guys, I have no problems with you spending your time surfing the internet. Doing so would lessen profits the more of you who do it and could in the long run, potentially mean we have to close down, but still, it’s fine.”

There will be a core group of employees who will continue to work hard, who value their work ethic. Nothing wrong there.

There will be a core group of employees who surf the internet all day. They’ve been told they’re allowed to, so why not? Nothing wrong there either. The hard-working employers don’t like these guys, but neither party are doing anything wrong, it is just a difference in mindset.

The hard workers can try to encourage all they like, and may convert a few of the internet surfers, but there will still remain a smaller core group who feel they are working perfectly fine, because the boss has said their behaviour is A-OK as far as the rules are concerned.

What’s the only way this will change? By the big boss saying, “Hey guys, I’ve changed my mind. You internet surfers are costing me profit. Book your ideas up, or you’re going to get fired.”

Some of the internet surfers change their ways, and become hard workers. They like it here, and want to keep their job, and if it means changing their ways a little, then fair enough.

Some of them remain as they were, and get fired by the boss – never to return.

Do you see what I am getting at? You cannot expect everybody to (want) to share your own personal code of ethics and conduct. We are all different, we all think different. The only thing that matters, is what the guys upstairs say.

Again, third time – not saying the rules are flawed, or anything. Just my own view on things.

Dey

[Pieman]

I've had cabal enemies ask me to hold off because they are doing something RP orientated (IC'ly ofcourse) and I've found something else to do. This is an RP mud and sometimes its not all about ME.

I dunno, if I was ever told this by a char in game I would be all gung-ho like where are you whats going on, i wanna join! Then whatever this nexus fiend is doing I can throw in the other side with my goodie! And fight about it!

[Aulian]

I dunno' date=' if I was ever told this by a char in game I would be all gung-ho like where are you whats going on, i wanna join! Then whatever this nexus fiend is doing I can throw in the other side with my goodie! And fight about it![/quote']

Exactly.. But sometimes aka a wedding - you just gotta wait.

Or at Byrsypherus' funeral. The Leader of Watcher walked into a room with 5 other Tribbies and they didnt attack me, they actually listened to my wee speech and I left unscathed. (although I'll give you 10c to the $ none of them actually understood wtf Dumela said. )

[Deykari]

(although I'll give you 10c to the $ none of them actually understood wtf Dumela said. )

I'll drink to that.

Dey

[HouselessRogue]

Double post... sorry about that. See below:

[HouselessRogue]

I can promise that no one understood what Dumela said. Ever! Probably why you were leader...

I have been playing this mud off and on for quite a while now. I have never really been active on the forum until recently. FL is not an easy mud to learn to play. I have played others that are much easier. FL is Tough, Tough, Tough, BUT, I love it. Does it suck to get full looted? Yep. Does it suck to get ganged? Yep. Does it suck to get multied? Yep. Is it realistic? Yep.

If you want someone to hold your hand and show you everything to do, yeah, go somewhere else. If you learn to RP you can get help from all kinds of sources. Even the monster that is Triathix helps out those that are on his side. Quit relying on the forum and IMMS to show you the way and test the friggin' waters. In RL do you learn by seeing or doing? It's not rocket science. You are going to die. You are going to get Full Looted. Deal with it. You will become better. I have become 100x the player I was even a year ago. That's what makes this place great. Always something new to learn or a concept to try. And guess what, with knowledge there is power.

Full looting doesn't need to be changed. Someone said recently I expect to get full looted everytime I die. If there is anything left on my corpse, I consider it a bonus. (Eerrr.... something like that.) To that person I say **CLAP**.

I guess the only other advice I can give is don't play drunk. I took a series of deaths on my latest char and woke up with him deleted. I only remember about 2% of that night. Sucks... wish I hadn't done that. I was rather enjoying him but again... live and learn. No more MUI's for me.

Life's a garden, dig it.

[Pali]

RP and LEARNING is something that needs to be encouraged.

I dont mean by cheering it on in the forums. But allowing those moments to occur, and allowing yourself to step back and say hey, I could roll this group of three or I can go sit in Emerald and read the forums. Sure rolling is fun but lets let the newer players newb it out a bit.

You know, every single time that a group of mine has been killed by a single guy, it has made me think one of two things: "Damnit, I should've been paying closer attention" or "Damn he's strong... how'd he do that?!" Each time it has happened has made me a better player, either by encouraging vigilance or by teaching me superior tactics... and 90% of the time, if I say something to the killer that isn't just whining about the death/attack, they're just fine with chatting about their assault with me. So, I'm sorry, but I simply cannot agree with encouraging people to NOT attack others. Maybe what we need instead is to encourage people to converse maturely with their attackers, or encourage them more to try to learn from their mistakes.

And how do you know if someone's a newb or not simply by seeing them in a group in Emerald, anyways?

I can honestly say that I feel someone going out and purposely killing (without real reasons.. And I have had people tell me their real reason is "because I want you to kneel at my feet." or "Im testing you." - never mind the fact that I've never even logged on before at the same time.) Someone while they are talking to someone or trying to DEFINE their OWN CHARACTERS (something by far, not done by many... Morchial do I miss you.) Is in every way counter productive.

How is "I want you to kneel at my feet" not a real reason? My undead monk, Vhalen, had a number of flunkies because I went up to them, pounded them into mercy, and demanded that they either promise to obey me before they stood again or they'd die. Wanting power and dominance over others (however you get it) is perfectly good RP, especially for an evil.

OFCOURSE there are times where you have to barge in. But a lot of the times it doesn't have to be run in and dirt.

Surprising your target is the best way to beat them.

We all need to define who we are. By running around with a [WATCHER] flag is not in any means a personal definition. Its a small branch of who you are, how you react/act and what you want out of life. The only way one can form an identity is by interaction. YOU CANNOT KNOW WHAT A CHARACTER IS ABOUT BY ASSUMING THEY HAVE THIS ALLIANCE AND THATS THAT. You need to interact to share your own personal identity, to know and understand each other and develop the game to its full potential.

I disagree that having the Watcher flag is not a personal definition. If I was a member of the United States Marines, you bet I'd identify as a Marine. Cabals are organizations you are willing to dedicate your life (and probably death) to the service of. Your ideals and goals are supposed to reflect your cabal's ideals and goals (or at least be compatible with them). If your character cannot devote himself to the service of the cabal, or if the cabal's goals aren't goals your character shares, he shouldn't be in it (Ilendriel had repeated requests from Knights that he join them, and I refused every one because Ilendriel's #1 goal was protecting Shas, and he couldn't subordinate that to Knight's goals).

In short, yes, being in a cabal IS a matter of personal definition. EDIT: And therefore, killing someone for being in a cabal with goals you are against is perfectly valid RP. It's not like gang members in real life always bother to get to know personally members of other gangs, and why they're in them, and if they're nice guys... they see the wrong colors/bandannas/handshakes/etc. and are often willing to kill on the spot because of it.

[myrek]

I read these responses and some of it really pissed me off. Then I realized that those posters probably missed a key point. This thread was GROSSLY OVER THE TOP on purpose. It is sarcasm. It's tongue-in-cheek. It's total bull****. I flat out said that all the players are full of crap. I wasn't excluding me. I apologize if this wasn't clear enough.

However, these are all topics that have been derailing other threads. The moderators are even starting to warn us about it. Here you go. Here's a place to DEBATE all the crap we've already been debating about.

And before you go getting all personal on what a piece of crap I am, you don't know me. You know Myrek and Myrek is just another character.

[a-guitarist]

And before you go getting all personal on what a piece of crap I am' date=' you don't know me. You know Myrek and Myrek is just another character.[/quote']

You've made a post that can be read as trolling. I understand what you've done, not every else does/will. Consequently, you can't really be the character of Myrek on the forums and have people treat you nicely.

Hell, when I try and crack a joke or two I'm (about 80% of the time) flamed for my "flame". There should be some sarcasm flag that you can add to posts that will change the text. Maybe something that makes everything typed italics (for the flamboyant part of sarcasm), under lined (for being over the top), and bold (for the 'in-your-face') of it.

a-g

[Shinth]

I read these responses and some of it really pissed me off. Then I realized that those posters probably missed a key point. This thread was GROSSLY OVER THE TOP on purpose. It is sarcasm. It's tongue-in-cheek. It's total bull****. I flat out said that all the players are full of crap. I wasn't excluding me. I apologize if this wasn't clear enough.

However, these are all topics that have been derailing other threads. The moderators are even starting to warn us about it. Here you go. Here's a place to DEBATE all the crap we've already been debating about.

And before you go getting all personal on what a piece of crap I am, you don't know me. You know Myrek and Myrek is just another character.

Mya was right!

If you don't want to get PKed, read myrek's quote from my sig.

[EyeSeeU]

To say 20 is the peak is definately an understatement ... but ya' date=' the original intent of this thread seems to belittle the playerbase.[/quote']

It only belittles you if A) It is true. Other then that I don't see a problem with how this was approached. It was humorous and comical and some of it should not have been taken to "oh he thinks the imms are retarded!" smite him hes an unholy smiter. I just think a lot of people let the game get to serious for their life. Remember folks I want progression and all that but the GAME IS NOT REAL. Let people say what they think and want you to hear, if you don't like it then don't read it. That is your choice. Yeah sure everyone can suggest how to do things in game and not do this because it will open up another avenue for that, however I rarely see that happen, so what good is all of this anyways if it's only forum talk. Take it in the game and change the way most of us feel and think, that is the only way.

[Montahg]

It only belittles you if A) It is true. Other then that I don't see a problem with how this was approached. It was humorous and comical and some of it should not have been taken to "oh he thinks the imms are retarded!" smite him hes an unholy smiter. I just think a lot of people let the game get to serious for their life. Remember folks I want progression and all that but the GAME IS NOT REAL. Let people say what they think and want you to hear' date=' if you don't like it then don't read it. That is your choice. Yeah sure everyone can suggest how to do things in game and not do this because it will open up another avenue for that, however I rarely see that happen, so what good is all of this anyways if it's only forum talk. Take it in the game and change the way most of us feel and think, that is the only way.[/quote']

It's not a matter of taking the game too seriously. The reason it got on my nerves is because the imms put a lot of time and effort into the game, and I tried to imagine how I would feel if someone said my decisions were retarded - jokingly or not - I'd at least be a little annoyed. I'm grateful the game is here to be played, I just felt Myrek was coming off as being ungrateful.

[Imoutgoodbye]

Hmmm...I wonder if this has anything to do with the recent downturn in voting?

Maybe this "harden up or **** off mentality" has some people not wanting to bring in new players?

Personally, I haven't logged in almost seven days now. Closing in on that magical number, where I've been told, "the kid gloves come off".

[Iusedtobesomebody]

It's not a matter of taking the game too seriously. The reason it got on my nerves is because the imms put a lot of time and effort into the game' date=' and I tried to imagine how I would feel if someone said my decisions were retarded - jokingly or not - I'd at least be a little annoyed. I'm grateful the game is here to be played, I just felt Myrek was coming off as being ungrateful.[/quote']

As a former level 59 IMM here at FL, I completely got the seven layers of sarcasm in Myrek's posts. I also agree with the 'harden up princess' mentality. I'm 'old school', I guess. it teaches you so much quicker than hand holding or coddling. *shrug*