The Drive to Success

[Malchaeius]

Ladies and Gentlemen,

I am posting today because I want to lay down a gauntlet. By this time next year, I hope to double the size of our playerbase - from an average amount of 22 at peak time to 44. This will take a good amount of work from both the staff and the playerbase.

Things we are doing to improve the MUD:

• Balancing equipment
  
• Working on new areas
  
• Working on new skills/sytems
  
• Working on cabal related things
  
• Website
  

Things we need you guys to help with:

• Advertisement / Recruiting / Voting
  
• Creating an even more immersive experience for players (new or otherwise)
  
• Brainstorming
  

Advertisement is crucial. I am sure we can all think of some creative ways to get the name of the MUD out there using vehicles that have not quite been done. One method for advertisement that I do not think we have seen is Youtube. Maybe make a video of some sort.

Once our website is done, I hope to host things such as Icor's graphic novel, perhaps a player picture page, videos, and other things that will get our name out there.

Use this thread to brainstorm some more advertisement and recruitment ideas to get our MUD out there, bringing us back to the glory days of 40-60 peak.

[Aeva]

One thing that I know scares away new players for fact is how ruthless the players here can be at lower levels.

When you have level 18 fire giants bashing the crap out of everything, grouped goodies gangbanging and full saccing somebody that was just rping in some noobie gear, and other crap like that, it's a lot easier for someone to grab the mouse and click "WoW" than it is to bother even spending 5 minutes learning a game that has no graphics.

It doesn't bother me much, just as I'm sure it's no biggie to a lot of you. I only really play for fun these days, plus most of us here on the forums know enough to get basics and crap in a HURRY if needed. That said, the last two people that I know in "real life" that I was able to actually convince to play were gone within two days because of crap like that.

[Aeva]

Another thought - we need think about what kind of people we're going to draw in. Imho, it's most likely going to be people from other txt games, or at least a background in it - NOT folks from wow or other sorts of online crack.

A website overhaul would work wonders. New, flashy stuff can always keep someone's attention for at least...a second or two! haha

[Iusedtobesomebody]

grouping to gain exp needs to be encouraged. this is the pivotable time to help newbies, and to build and expand your own rp. with the addition of guild quest exp, I have noticed a decrease in groups. I like having them as a backup, but grouping NEEDS to be everyone's preferred choice. a decrease in guild quest exp and an increase in group exp is the only way I can see encouraging this.

as a newbie myself many years ago, grouping with experienced players taught me much- from eq to areas to the best hunting zones. couple this with a 30ish cabal entrance level and we will see newer players grow quickly.

[Ex-D&Der]

RP with newbies when you're ranking with them. Make it real.

[Questioner]

A major detraction, which has been stated before, is that this community is absolutely ruthless when it comes to player killing. If I saw this mud on the TMS listing, saw that it was top 5 (erm...hello?), and I logged on, chances are I would be discouraged by the high learning curve. Only the most persistant seem to find their way over the threshold and go on to be good players. We also have some who are very persistant...but are consistently mutilated by the pathetic plasm beast.

Sorry Dey, I just couldn't resist.

My two cents. If I have any more change to be found, I will throw it into the pile.

[Evangelion]

Allowing eight-year veterans (of which there are very few left) to contribute to the MUD more fully.

[Iusedtobesomebody]

Allowing eight-year veterans (of which there are very few left) to contribute to the MUD more fully.

no one is giving you an IMM.

[Malchaeius]

Use this thread to brainstorm some more advertisement and recruitment ideas to get our MUD out there' date=' bringing us back to the glory days of 40-60 peak.[/quote']

This is more of a "brainstorm for advertisement and recruitment" thread instead of a "What is wrong with the MUD" thread. There are plenty of those threads already.

For example: Icor's drawings, Raargant's story, An player (who will remain unnamed, lest they reveal so themselves) is also writing a novel based on one of his characters, Youtube videos, advertising to popular DnD groups. These are the sort of ideas I am looking for and those who would volunteer some time to those efforts.

[Grosek_]

After being gone for 2-3 year, I've come back to look around. I've noticed a couple things, but in regards to advertising and whatnot... what you've mentioned thus far Malch, who in their right mind would read an FL graphic novel unless they were a regular player here? Who would read short stories from amateur writers, unless they played or worked here?

You need to actually invest a bit of money and time in real advertising and not unrealistic free stuff if you want to increase like you said.

Muds are sort of fading out anyways, so what you really need to do for an increase like that is to take players away from other MUDS. Even if there are things here that others don't have, will it be enough to make players give up what they know? Have you ever had the inclination to try another mud? More often than not, you will return to what is most familiar, not what is better.

That is if there is not something forcing you to stay, or some reason tying you to the place. But I am getting ahead of myself.

How will anyone know about all these wonderful things a mud has if they haven't heard of the mud before, been given a reason to try the mud, or just plain something of that nature?

Now I am posing alot of questions, but I feel these need to be addressed. Once you hook the people, then graphic novels are wonderful... as are short stories. However, at this point in time, you need the players... the players don't necessarily need you (so to speak). Effort to sell the mud needs to be made.

Three suggestions I would have on this end are :

(1) Pay for a place on Zmud.

(2) Consider becoming an active poster on mudmagic and other mud forums. Other mud admins are.

(3) Troll other forums.

Now of course the last one might be considered a garbage way to do things, but hey.. I am just putting it out there. That is one way the founders of this mud did things. You need to get people here, the mud and staff should be able to keep them here... right?

Anyways, those are my two cents. One more suggestion is take take wizinvis away from the staff, or some of them anyways.

[Malchaeius]

I disagree about the graphic novel. A good story is a good story, regardless of where it comes from. If someone reads a good story and learns there is a place where you can actually -live- that story, I would imagine that would be quite a draw. I cannot count how many times I have heard about a great movie and I went out and purchased the book or graphic novel that it was based upon and vice versa. One piece of media can entice someone to look into another.

[Iusedtobesomebody]

This is more of a "brainstorm for advertisement and recruitment" thread instead of a "What is wrong with the MUD" thread. There are plenty of those threads already.

hrmm, my post was in reference to the 'creating an immersive atmosphere for newer players' part of the main post. forcing people to interact by grouping would do that. *shrug* just an idea.

[Malchaeius]

Not targetted specifically at you. Just making sure it did not derail/devolve into that. I do not mind those threads, as there tends to be a couple of good ideas borne out of them - it was just not my intention for this particular thread.

[Grosek_]

Well, that is only my opinion, and I don't run a mud... so my opinion could be discounted pretty easy. Your point about a graphic novel being somewhat of a draw is pretty true... except... who will read it? I am certain I won't find it on my normal websites nor my favorite bookstore. How will you get it to them? It is an amateur work, no matter how good it is. You would have to advertise the novel in order to advertise the mud.

EDIT :

I do know some people will read it, but you are looking for a pretty big increase here, man. +22 avg users means +50-60 new users... at least.

EDIT EDIT :

I just realized I sound pretty negative. I don't mean to, I just really think if you want to get the ball rolling we all need to take a very serious look at what has worked for other muds first. I will quiet down now. Sorry guys.

[WarriorCleric]

You need to actually invest a bit of money and time in real advertising and not unrealistic free stuff if you want to increase like you said.

If it's free and produced by the players it doesn't cost the staff their time or money.

The use of the player produced material isn't as just an advertising model, it's a retention device. It creates a community that rewards players for producing their own art.

And I don't see anywhere where it was said that the Staff would sit on there hands and expect players to do all the work.

Getting twenty more players to try the game tomorrow won't help at all if we have the same community that has bled players all along, the same lack of extra tidbits that make the experience unique.

If you want people to stay, you have to give them a reason to when they get here. Advertising doesn't do that, substance does.

WC

[tassinvegeta]

I've been here for awhile and known quite a few players to have come and gone. These are just my experiences alone that I'd like to share. Some have left because they have little time to play and losing cabal spots, eq kinda take the purpose out of playing. Not saying we can do anything about this but that's one of the reasons why the certain type of player would leave. Others leave because of frustrations and imbalances in the game. A great many will look at this mud and compare it to another similar mud (two of which I will not mention). They'll look at a class and say how come fl's xxx class doesn't have all these flashy things that xxx mud's xxx class has? Over the years many things have been toned down to fix imbalances and though this is a quick fix to a problem it ultimately hurts our goal. For instance battlemages have been toned. Players whom at one time wanted to play one will not want to anymore, if you look at the number of bmg's after the change can you really say i'm wrong? How many times have something got toned up and we've seen dozens of players come out of nowhere wanting to play them? Grosek does have a point, i'm sure plenty of muds have those short stories but what would make players read them? What really attracts mud players are flashy things. I.E. skills, spells, variety, changes. Though I do want to point out that these new ideas of the graphical novel and short stories are a great idea. But they'll most likely will only aim to keep the players already here, here.

[Grosek_]

If it's free and produced by the players it doesn't cost the staff their time or money.

The use of the player produced material isn't as just an advertising model, it's a retention device. It creates a community that rewards players for producing their own art.

And I don't see anywhere where it was said that the Staff would sit on there hands and expect players to do all the work.

Getting twenty more players to try the game tomorrow won't help at all if we have the same community that has bled players all along, the same lack of extra tidbits that make the experience unique.

If you want people to stay, you have to give them a reason to when they get here. Advertising doesn't do that, substance does.

WC

Everything you said is true, but I was trying to keep on the tracks for the thread that Malch set down.

Also, we have to look at this realistically enough to say that if we get 20 players to try it... maybe a quarter will stay over a few months. You are right that we need retention, but we also need sheer numbers... it is a numbers game in the end. If (and I am not saying we do) we have retention problems, it is something we can work on... but will not be fixed over night. In the mean time, it just means the advertising effort just needs to be stronger, and more avenues pursued.

[goldbond]

WB grosek!

[Celerity]

So, in a nutshell:

Update listings/ads

WEBPAGE!

balance low and high level PK (how? read below!)

PK ranges

group questing

RP development (how? read below!)

player accounts

I always use www.mudconnect.com to find new muds...including when I found this one. We really need to update our listing there. We don't use nobles/royal anymore and our army 'game' isn't anything like RISK. 80% original areas actually hurts the advertisement I think...might not want to even mention that.

One of the main reasons I chose this MUD was because there were no channels that can be heard across the game. No gossip, ooc, chat, or shout here. When I get on a new MUD, the first thing I always do is read the MOTD and look at the date. Also the date on the webpage.

We also might want to stress the RP a bit more in the advertisement. Also maybe talk about the PK system, number of skills/spells/races/classes etc.

So, like it was said above..the big ways to get new players are basically through advertisement. zMUD/gMUD ads would bring people. Banners, reviews, updated listings, a comprehensive website (we realllllly need this soon), and of course forum trolling.

I think retention is the larger problem however. Basically, this boils down to two key things: having something to do and wanting to do it.

There are three main things that most people do here:

Leveling

PK prep (eq, training, consumables, getting in a cabal, qrace)

PK

Like I said before in many threads, we need to make more INTERESTING things to do. The more things we have to do on the MUD, the more players will want to play. Yes, PK alone will retain many players (just look at our playerbase!), but as said before the curve is sharp and almost all players won't make it (especially after 8 years of practice for some of the competition).

Our RP is system is basically a chatroom (emote everything, socials, and speech). Most of our races aren't fleshed out (in the name of leaving things 'open' to the player). I think most players would rather work themselves into a developed history and world rather than making up homes/events with each character. Player backgrounds are sooo much more interesting AND MEANINGFUL when they are tied to the world they are in. We really need to flesh out the histories, personalities, and such of the races/classes/world. Let the players be creative WITHIN that history.

Like said before, we need things like RP skills, player homes/businesses, player religions, meaningful clans...anything to get players involved so that they think their character ACTUALLY MEANS SOMETHING to the MUD. If somebody feels important and needed, you can bet they will stay. If we make RP clothes, we should have some RP meaning to use them.

Make titles less elitest. I believe that almost every character (who is a hero in their own right) should earn some title by the time they even get to 50. It does two really important things---it proves to the character the IMMs are watching them perform 'deeds' AND it gives a unique sense of worth to every character. IMMs should randomly snoop/follow characters, watch what they are doing and give them a suitable title (good or bad). Doesn't have to big or anything world-shaking

Balance low-level PK. My idea for this is to simplify the game at low levels. Everyone starts at level one as an adventurer of their chosen race. At level 10, everyone branches into a basic class (warrior, thief, cleric, invoker). At level 25 everyone has the option to branch again into their final class. (paladin, ninja, berserker, battlemage, etc).

Why do this? First of all, for new players---they don't know anything about the different classes outside of a help file. This would get them playing and leveling...letting them learn the system as their character advances. By level 10, they should have a basic idea for their character--level 25 they have to commit to a final path. It gets the pressure away from character generation. Second, it let's people DEVELOP into their characters. Third, it makes it much easier to balance low level PK. Instead of trying to rework all the classes from levels 10-25, we now only have to balance 4 classes from levels 10-25.

We can use the current selection system to choose new classes. Don't allow players to level until they make a choice. This will solve many (not all) of the low-level pk problems and is pretty easy to implement.

For example:

Level 1 Adventurer -> Level 10 Warrior -> Level 25 Paladin

Level 1 Adventurer -> Level 10 Warrior -> Level 25 Warrior

Level 1 Adventurer -> Level 10 Cleric -> Level 25 Paladin

I can go from warrior to paladin or stay as a warrior

OR

I can go from cleric to paladin (or stay as a cleric)

This should allow all choices for all races. (ex. thief --> ranger OR war --> ranger will allow all races to become rangers that can be rangers)

Balance PK at high levels. I do think that most race/classes are balanced. I do NOT think that most race/class/cabal choices are balanced. I believe the primary PK benefit of cabals should not be cabal powers but cabal FRIENDs. The easiest way to balance high-level PK would be to weaken cabal powers and get rid of life-insurance finally...a few normal things still need to be looked (ex. headbutt, # of blm strikes with 2-handed weapons, turn undead, hold undead, kick, etc). Also, please make shield expertise a weapon expertise choice, not a lore!

Group quests---instead of the guildmasters giving the quests, let the trainers do it. Embark on quests with friends!!

Here's a big one...remove PK ranges (gasp!). This has always been a major turn-off for me and I believe it really inhibits a LOT of RP. It is hard to get vassals, extort, or do much of anything (using game skills) with people outside of your PK range.

But..won't some idiot 50 just go and kill everyone at rank 10??!!?!! Yes, it is certainly possible! But, we can make deincentives for that kind of behavior without some hard-corded PK range. For example, the most basic would be: You don't lose con for dying to someone much higher in rank than you. You still get a death on your tally, lose your eq, and what not however. The reverse is true, you don't get any PK benefit (outside of their EQ) from killing/dueling people too low in rank...no path charge, no malform charge, no cabal points, etc.

So, if I die, I can just reequip off some lowbie? Certainly, if you want to make that choice. This would probably work in the beginning too. This is where the interesting part comes in. If you are new in a dangerous place, what is the first thing you want to do? Make strong friends. If you are a strong person, what do you want? More minions/henchman/vassals/employees/whatever! Wow...we just opened up something big there! You mean high-ranks would be interested in interacting with low-ranks? To the point that they even seek each other out?! Wow, think of the RP there! Yeah, maybe I do suck at PK. But I got to level 50 with my DK. Can't beat anyone here, but it does give me some renown and I can bully weaker characters (like a true DK!). Relationships bloom, characters make connections, vendettas..wow wow wow. Suddenly someone who gets stomped by other big names has something to live for and some means to improve her position! Brains, politics, networking become as important as pure PK. Suddenly we have a kind of balance! So yes, that crap DK could pk the level 25 for their crap eq, but that in the end, is that REALLY worth it? Depends on the two characters involved! Maybe yes! Either way, RP is there where there was none before!

We could even use the current system: If a person kills X amount of lowbies in Y amount of time, notes start getting sent to IMMs (much like excessive pk at low-ranks now). What is a lowbie? Anyone more than 8 ranks below you.

Also like before:

Player accounts. Each player has an account tied to the forum. All of their characters are listed in it. Log in to the mud, log into the account, log into the character. Good points? Don't need to remember character names, can see how much time each character has been played recently, can see the history your development on the mud (all your chars!)..and most importantly, if you mess up, much easier for the IMMs to temp ban/whatever you. No more logging on a proxy to get around bans (unless you want to make a new character/account to do that--what a waste!) If all your chars are punished, much less likely to break the rules too.

[Twinblades713]

Here's a big one...remove PK ranges (gasp!). This has always been a major turn-off for me and I believe it really inhibits a LOT of RP. It is hard to get vassals' date=' extort, or do much of anything (using game skills) with people outside of your PK range.[/quote']

I personally would like to see this work.

[Grosek_]

I have to agree a lot with Celerity. I couldn't bring myself to read everything she said, but scanning through... it looked good.

[a-guitarist]

Everything you said is true, but I was trying to keep on the tracks for the thread that Malch set down.

Also, we have to look at this realistically enough to say that if we get 20 players to try it... maybe a quarter will stay over a few months. You are right that we need retention, but we also need sheer numbers... it is a numbers game in the end. If (and I am not saying we do) we have retention problems, it is something we can work on... but will not be fixed over night. In the mean time, it just means the advertising effort just needs to be stronger, and more avenues pursued.

While sure, it could be as simple as advertising and getting a massive influx of people into the game... it won't be. The amount of people you'd have to draw in to get them to stick around would be astronomical, if you were not adapting the game to current playing standards in the "industry" (by which, I mean gaming, not MUDing).

As with people who play MUDs, they do so because they have a higher standard of play than graphical MMOs. Maybe not all, but most. When was the last time you had a decent hour of roleplaying in WoW or EQ? How about the last time you RPed in FL? Alright, now, what about PK in WoW? It's all over the place... FL? Even more so. MUDs are far more a community than WoW, and also (obviously) massively smaller. What does this mean? We've gotta step it up, pull our heads out of our collective asses and stop being whiny little school-girls when someone upsets us. (Myself included, other than me, I'm not pointing any fingers)

Ditch the "I'm owed something." attitude a lot of us have, and realize that if we want to have this fun we feel we are "owed" then we have to make it happen. It's like internet porn... you can watch it all you like, but nothings gonna happen until you take the steps to help yourself.

FL is great, love it. Not gonna say what I think is wrong with it, because it's very little and does nothing to help the game right now.... but....

If we want to draw people in WC is right, it's more effective to do something that will make them stay. Substance is better then volume. Quality over quantity.

If Malch wants 20 new average players online, then we're gonna do better by enticing the 50 new players that check us out with something amazing than if we leave it the way it is and say "Hey, let's blow a wad of cash on TMS, TMC, MMO.com and all these other places Advertising." We may get 100 new players... but they're not going to stick around.

Further more, it isn't all on the IMMs, it's been said by many players here already, we, has a pbase, have got to step up and make the game for newer players. I get freaking livid when I see someone on the forums talk about how no one helps newbies in game, no one answers questions in game. Why? They're lying. Plain and simple.

I have a character that is basically being RPed as a newbie. (Shock, RPing total lack of knowledge on everything world wise, not mechanics wise). How much help do I get? Massive amounts. I have people showing me things (some ... okay, lots... I didn't already know), I have players checking up on me, and I have players asking for help once I share my knowledge with them. What did it take? I was nice to them, (Or RPed well with them, even if my char was mean to them) and treated their character as my character would... but it doesn't end there. You (not your character) have to treat them (not their character, but the player) as you would in real life (with kindness and respect).

This is great. RP is great. I think everyone just expects it to find them. Make it happen. Icor was right, never say "no" in RP. It'll open a whole new world. My Character's rp has been fluid and changed because of interactions with evils, goods, and neutrals. Take everything in and then vomit it back out with your own contents. At first you might not like it... but after you start losing the weight of 8+ years of status quo (for you, not the game) you start to realize that anything is possible.... hell, Dey killed someone once... if he can do that, it's diffidently a McWorld.

a-g

[Kyzarius]

Until a new player doesnt get their *** kicked form one end of the world to another and end up naked after spending hours trying to learn how to get titanium bracers or some other lowbie item no amount of advertising is going to increase our player base.

The curse of FL is that the playstyles and aggressive PK that the veteran players like is the EXACT same thing that drives away all but the .5% of new players who are stubborn enough or bored enough to keep getting up over and over and over and over.

In the end its just not fun for them, heck, not a week goes by where a long time player doesnt go off the edge and make some thread about how the game isnt fun for them for these EXACT SAME REASONS.

As an individual who has managed customer retention in the past I would say you need to not only increase the influx of customers, but the ability of your buisness to retain them once they have bitten your hook.

[Questioner]

Just throwing this out there: Increase the incentives, and player retention increases.

[Evangelion]

I agree with Questioner, unfortunately. Human nature is what it is - and for some people, interaction isn't its own reward.

Going along with this, I really think one of the thing that frustrates any number of players is the difficulty of getting a Quest Class. And seeing as how Malchaeius and Eshaine are two of the most active IMMs, and are both in charge of all the qraces/qclasses, it can only be chalked up to their standards which, in this case, may need to be lowered. Not everyone can play a vampire as well as Despiser.