Class Rankings

[Mudder]

I agree with with the scale for the most part. However! Berserkers have the same eq problem, if not worse, than warriors and less PK viability. Because they both have to be decked to be good but a decked warrior will have a much easier time against any class (except maybe cleric if the correct paths were chosen) than a berserker.

In fact. If I count class selections, Warrior will definitely come on top. Because a Zerk anger will do good against a cleric, a Warrior whip lock will do better.

yeah' date=' i think thieves should be way less reliable on EQ. To a good thief, your eq is theres, more and more the longer you fight them.

Heck with Silithis I could dress myself in my oponnents gear from being completly naked to decked without even killing them.

another valid category would be how easy or difficult it is to equip a certian class.

While I agree, I think this counts more towards PK viability than eq dependence.

EDIT: Also, a Goodie Cleric is easier to kill with than a Berserker. So is a Bard. No way in hell do I think a berserker and evil cleric are equal on the PK scene.

[Imoutgoodbye]

I would like to add that monks aren't as reliant on equipment as you believe.

[Nekky]

I agree with with the scale for the most part. However! Berserkers have the same eq problem, if not worse, than warriors and less PK viability. Because they both have to be decked to be good but a decked warrior will have a much easier time against any class (except maybe cleric if the correct paths were chosen) than a berserker.

In fact. If I count class selections, Warrior will definitely come on top. Because a Zerk anger will do good against a cleric, a Warrior whip lock will do better.

While I agree, I think this counts more towards PK viability than eq dependence.

EDIT: Also, a Goodie Cleric is easier to kill with than a Berserker. So is a Bard. No way in hell do I think a berserker and evil cleric are equal on the PK scene.

I agree that a whip mastery warrior may perform better overall against tough classes, in the sense that they will consistently make them flee more. But I think that a berzerker has the undefinable variables that can lead to more kills. This is especially true against classes that are essentially un-laggable.

Against clerics/healers or other unlaggable types, a whip mastery warrior may ruin them, and force them to recall or flee a lot. And on the same note, a berzerker might have to run from them more often than not. But a zerk has the potential to throw out cleaves, headbutts, haymakers or whatever that can suddenly turn the fight around.

[L-A]

Pretty biased/opinion based. Interested shaman less eq based than invoker. Also interesting that zerk is 1 point below warrior and so on.

Personally, I don't think tables like this mean anything - take me for example: I can play a dark knight well but my warriors are weaker than my berserkers. I can do clerics and shaman but have never got an invoker to 50.

Certain classes work better for certain people. Its as simple as that.

L-A

[Grumpy]

I think berserker eq reliance should be upped to at least 5, rage compensates for needed hit/dam.

And no qclasses?

[MadCowDisease]

didnt evangelion already say that this was done in his opinion and nothing else? of course it will be opinionated. all its meant to be is a way to kinda give a basic idea of how classes play out for newbies to the mud.

yes certain people are better with certain classes. what this table does is shows basics of a class to somebody who has never played the mud before. it gives them an idea of what to expect. i think its common sense that it wont give you the exact experience of playing a class just by reading it.but if i was brand new to the mud and read it, i definately would not have picked the class i did to start. having classes explained to you, (for instance: people talking to you, or reading the help files), while helpful in its own way, is different than having a statistical breakdown and comparison between classes.

personally, i think that we should have more tables like this from other experienced players either created or linked here. that might provide a little more clarity as to which classes are generally easier to pick up on.

thank you, evangelion, for posting this. its inspired me to do a little experimenting.

[Twinblades713]

While I love (To hate) Evangelion, I think he failed to recall that here at FL, your opinion can be wrong.

But less mean, I think it's at least just a fun something to ponder if nothing else.

[Mudder]

I agree that a whip mastery warrior may perform better overall against tough classes' date=' in the sense that they will consistently make them flee more.[/color'] But I think that a berzerker has the undefinable variables that can lead to more kills. This is especially true against classes that are essentially un-laggable.

Against clerics/healers or other unlaggable types, a whip mastery warrior may ruin them, and force them to recall or flee a lot. And on the same note, a berzerker might have to run from them more often than not. But a zerk has the potential to throw out cleaves, headbutts, haymakers or whatever that can suddenly turn the fight around.

So what you just said was, Warriors can and will consistently own. However Berserkers can turn a fight around that they were previously losing.

Forcing your enemies to flee is the key to victory. From there you have to chase. Simple as that. A warrior is far stronger than a berserker in terms of PK ability and powerspike. Especially when all classes are taken into consideration. My warrior would 2 round clerics. Who even needs bash at that point?

[MadCowDisease]

i am resisting the urge to derail this to another zerker thread.

[Mudder]

i am resisting the urge to derail this to another zerker thread.

Crap your right. Okay. I'll stop. Lol.

[Nekky]

I misspoke, I didn't mean a berserker used those skills to turn around a fight they were losing. I meant that a warrior might force a cleric/shaman/healer to flee and recall a bunch of times, but not actually kill them. Where a berserker might be able to land a surprise cleave, headbutt or haymaker, and couple with sudden rage damage, could seal the kill where they would previously have just worded away.

[Talcian]

Here is a link to something similiar to this:

http://forum.theforsakenlands.org/showthread.php?t=9894

One it doesn't look as clean, two this may be outdated, and three I don't think my numbers were the best, but Celerity did a revision later in the post. Might be worth a look.

[mya]

My warrior would 2 round clerics.

I think that is an exaggeration.

I have seen warriors pack clerics to their pit in 4 round, but not 2.

Clerics have a min of 650 HP's you need to eat through.

[Celerity]

My old class chart is outdated and I wouldn't call it applicable for today's FL.

[Guest emp_newb]

My warrior would 2 round clerics. Who even needs bash at that point?

I HIGHLY doubt this. HIGHLY Even a naked drow cleric, your not tossing out 350 damage a round through sanc.

[Mindflayer]

It most certainly is not.

It most certainly is.

[KRins]

Granted, paladins have the ability to heal and, given proper preparation, can run all over God's creation with a very low likelihood of running out of moves. However, they do not have access to significant lag protection...

Am I the only one who immediately thought MOUNTED COMBAT?!?! Can't be tripped, can't be air thrashed to be tripped from it, some bash resistance...and if you bash, odds are they will heal all, most, or more than the actual bash damage.

[Mudder]

I think that is an exaggeration.

I have seen warriors pack clerics to their pit in 4 round, but not 2.

Clerics have a min of 650 HP's you need to eat through.

I HIGHLY doubt this. HIGHLY Even a naked drow cleric' date=' your not tossing out 350 damage a round through sanc.[/quote']I just checked and I don't have any logs. It was Threkan vs Mephizex(when she was decked).

I would attack, whip lock, in a total of 2 rounds she was at awful wounds and very few hps left. She would recall because if she tried to flee, she would die.

EDIT: I agree Threkan is a bit of a special case, though I do not see why other warriors couldn't do the same under the circumstances.

[Guest emp_newb]

Well right there your NOT two rounding anyone. you need AT LEAST one round to weaponlock. So that is three. And also, to say you two rounded someone means you got the kill, which by your own admission, and Mephizex's, you did not.

[Andre]

I just checked and I don't have any logs. It was Threkan vs Mephizex(when she was decked).

I would attack, whip lock, in a total of 2 rounds she was at awful wounds and very few hps left. She would recall because if she tried to flee, she would die.

EDIT: I agree Threkan is a bit of a special case, though I do not see why other warriors couldn't do the same under the circumstances.

Get off the grass buddy. Never did I get two rounded by Threkkan, five to six rounds yea. mephizex had a total of about 900 hp. THERES no ways you can eat throug that in two rounds.

Far as I remember. Score was 2 - 0 to me

[Evangelion]

Am I the only one who immediately thought MOUNTED COMBAT?!?! Can't be tripped' date=' can't be air thrashed to be tripped from it, some bash resistance...and if you bash, odds are they will heal all, most, or more than the actual bash damage.[/quote']

Let me find the log of Grom vs Dyendas (Festy's old paladin). If you check my record, both of those fights were almost total, unenlarged bashlocks. Mounted Combat has its benefits - but the protection from bash/bodyslam/qskill(s) is often overestimated.

And I don't count trip as a reliable form of laglock, seeing as how anyone with half a brain will never be triplocked (EXCEPT by a monk, which is a different story altogether)...

Re Mindflayer: Necromancers are on the chart, and have two nice big asterisks next to the name...

[Mindflayer]

I'm only concerned with the viability rating you bestowed to the necromancer. I don't feel it's high enough.

[Pali]

If you check my record' date=' both of those fights were almost total, unenlarged bashlocks.[/quote']

My experience does not match yours, my friend. Ilendriel dueled warriors and zerks all the time - none of those times was I ever laglocked into the ground, and very rarely was I laglocked more than just 2-3 bashes in a row even.

[Twinblades713]

Heh, Ilendriel.

[Mudder]

Get off the grass buddy. Never did I get two rounded by Threkkan, five to six rounds yea. mephizex had a total of about 900 hp. THERES no ways you can eat throug that in two rounds.

Far as I remember. Score was 2 - 0 to me

Clearly you forgot fighting Threkan at his peak then. It was literally 2 rounds. If you didn't get the recall in you would have died from the next single attack. I don't remember you fighting me much at that time.