Rolling something new!

[mmajunkie]

Time is only one part of it though. If I'm a Demon DK wannabe and I'm rolling around steamrolling 20 people in two weeks and dying a couple times and taking those deaths badly, killing easy targets, etc BUT yes I do RP.....that doesn't exactly mean i deserve one of the most powerful combos in the game.

You can play 200 hours...but if 40 hours of that were spent PKing weaker people, breaking RP, ranking, training etc than you are nothing special. Merely an 80% well played character.

[KRins]

My big issue is that I could purchase firearms, acquire a job, and be fired from that job in the same amount of time to hear back on an application. There is being discerning, there is being picky, and there is thinking entirely too highly of yourself.

I feel like we need some perspective here, this is a game... a game that in no way affects the world outside of this forum. It isn't like you are enlisting in the military or running for public office where an exhaustive background check is necessary... you are trying to play a game. While a certain version of the game can be played at 30, no one likes the veiled barbs sent to 'ranksitters' by MANY characters. It is more than a little insane that we've decided it is alright for a handful of people in charge to take more time making fairly minute decisions in the big picture than a huge entity like the US government...

Which is the greater breech of RP, having to sit at 30 and do whatever you character would (as most Qraces are evil that tends to result in some PK...which people turn around and cry about and call you classless, lazy, and a variety of other things simply from my waiting period as Telisore) or calling someone BARELY veiled names in game for someone's decision making process that is COMPLETELY outside of their control?

[mmajunkie]

Sitting at 30 and doing what your character would do is fine. People crying to you about you PKing them while they are training/ranking is KINDA lame...but you should be going after QUALITY kills, not just padding your record. Their angst is justified, though they shouldn't necessarily jump your case about it. And heaven forbid you actually GET killed by someone and then break your own RP by doing stupid crap like name calling, spitting, etc. and expect people not to do the same back to you when you kill him.

Much of that can be solved by quicker turn around times on apps....get that 30 range cleared up. Any IMM online should take just a couple moments to snoop the 30rank applicant...if they see them doing some positive, make a note of it. Negative? Make a note of it. Governing IMM reviews all these things, plus their own findings, and makes a determination within a week or within 30-40 played hours.

But again, you have to always question whether or not this is taking away from the integrity, values, and traditions of this game that a lot of us have played for a decade. Times changes and the game must change with it...but there are some things at the core that I wouldn't want to see changed.

I'm all about faster app times as long as the person was indeed seen having quality RP and not being a douche. But people who go ooc after being killed, stalk super easy kills and bloat about it, etc those are not the kind of players that FL deserves and they certainly don't deserve powerful characters as rewards.

There's a fine line when it comes to what we as players think is "fair" to us and what is in the best interest of the game and everyone else, staff included.

[Zavero]

You need to read back at some of the threads about qrace/class. The best way to do it is to have minimal PK's and RP all the time. You just have to display your ability to PK and RP takes care of the rest.

It is a game and perhaps the wait times are too long. However, this is the standard of waiting for the things you want here. Expect 70-100 hours of play time before you get approved/rejected. If you don't like that then just don't make a qrace/class character. Other characters take less time and are just as effective.

You can point out that I am saying, "Just suck it up." However, perhaps that is what you need since all of you seem to have been fed with a silver spoon. Anything worthwhile you must wait for. How many hours does it take to get to pinnicle on WoW, FF11, or to your highest prestige in Call of Duty?

A long time. Of course, they are games too.

[Croyvern]

Absolutely no intention of poking the cage here.....

My opinion is that 100 hrs is not that long. If I may explain;

Lets assume you have outstanding RP, Let us also assume you are good at PK. Now let us assume you spent 30+ hrs getting to level thirty and wrote a premium application. In your mind, its a no brainer on the immortals end, they should just accept your app and let you be on with the character. However, lets look at it from the immortals perspective. Your character is thirty something hours old. While it may be your umteenth dark knight, and you may be able to play one incredibly well, the immortals have only had 30 or so hours to observe your rp and pk thus far. One hundred hours for a die hard player can be logged in far less than a month, less than a couple of weeks for some, and less than a week for a few. Now, if your application process works like the voting process for cabals, then each immortal will likely want to observe you personally before they cast their individual vote. Since not every immortal is present each time you log in, this could take a bit. While your brain tells you the decision is a no brainer, consider that the immortals may be split in the vote, maybe one or two is not real impressed. The hundred hours you are asked to spend RPing are your only hope to change the minds of these nay sayers. Use it, enjoy the chance to role play, and be thankful that the immortals are not forced, by some insane notion that they should vote immediately, to deny you.

This is just my opinion, and not intended as an attack on anyone elses opinion.

[mmajunkie]

I am deeply offended by your post Croyvern and request that you remove it immediately.

I agree with everything you said, I just always try to look at it from both ends. The tradition of MUDs and Mud IMMs has almost always been to help influence the world, not control it. Variations of a theme obviously in the different MUDs that exist, but this basic concept is what a true MU* is all about. An RP world created and maintained almost solely by the players. The staff is there to facilitate the world.

However in some MUDs this becomes twisted. It becomes a world that is there to live up to the staff's expectations and desires. No longer do you get rewarded for YOUR character...but only if you make your character meet the demands/requirements/RP of your God-IMM. Instead of a world that feels real because of all the unique things that everything can bring to the table, you get the same things over and over, just with new character names. No real fault of the player, but it just happens over time without notice.

I'm not saying that is what is going on here at our MUD, just that things are not always so cut and dry, nor are they easily solved.

It is our responsibility as players to live up to the standards the Staff has set for our characters and follow their rules with respect and dignity. Doing that though, should be enough to warrant you to get nearly anything you want, without having to spend a month of your real life time stuck at one level starting at a screen of 7 people online whom are all almost sure to be too busy to RP with you. The one guy in your PK range has notell on and is prolly training. Looks like you're stuck emoting to yourself again....and hope an IMM doesn't catch you getting bored with that and doing nothing or else you might just not get your app approved afterall.

I could create hundreds of examples both supporting the argument or arguing against it, all of which are legit and happen very often. Bottom line is there will be Pros and Cons no matter which why you shift things....and of course you cannot please everyone. At the end of the day you have to do what is best for the MUD in general. And the last thing we want is to start giving away Demon DKs and Ogre Avatars to anyone who is just gonna go OOC after they get killed or trash killing a bunch of ranking ppl or whatever.

And since teh only way to counter that is to carefully screen the people you give those things to........

Looks like we're all fuc*** :-)

[tassinvegeta]

Took me 2-300 hours to get even a word on one of my apps. After two weeks I think I sent a reminder or reposting, than after a month of nothing I think I went crazy. I had several things going on in my life and I would sacrifice part of my life to play even during those times. School, work, certifications, and training mma. I couldn't focus upon the game as much as I used to but I'd still try my best to play. I learned that its best to make the most of the little time you put in rather than spending countless hours doing little. Basically I felt encouraged not to play very much. So if you log in and constantly see those same two guys on your who list during your playtime its best to log off and wait until peak hours to make your mark on the Imms. Just look at the guys and Elders whom put in hours compared to the guys who don't. Which do you think are more deserving? The ones who put in hundreds of hours trying to make something happen when no one is on the wholist or the ones who barely happen to play during those peak times? I don't want to sound negative but I also don't want you to put too much into this game and find out later its not worth it. Most of us are adults here and aren't children who can easily throw away those 1,2, or 300 hours like we used to. Not saying I still won't do it, because this game does give me alot of enjoyment. Its just that at times it can be rough. And last time I checked, games were supposed to encourage enjoyment and for you to play more?

[f0xx]

I would just say one thing - if you don't like waiting, then don't. Noone makes you.

If you want to play one of those sweet demons, undeads, liches, avatars or crusaders though, you will not only have to wait A LOT, but you will also have to prove that you are something MORE THAN THE REST. You will have to prove that you actually deserve a QUEST thing.

Demon DK is the combo with highest potential in the game. We all know that. Expecting to get a combo with the highest potential easy, is just silly. If we add some of the infractions you've had recently, then that would made it next to impossible.

[tassinvegeta]

Foxx I just don't think its only the qrace/qclass wait that's killing people. Its the return of investment I think we're more concerned with. And the staggering low pb, rares, and feeling overlooked. Though I see some of these factors have gotten better over the recent months. Imms are working hard to fix them while dealing with there personal lives. Many custom titles have come out, rare fixes, Imms who like to rp with us . These things help alot.

[Kyzarius]

Foxx I just don't think its only the qrace/qclass wait that's killing people.

sure does kill the game for those who have done 90% of the regular class/race combos twice

[KRins]

I wasn't saying I want qstuff handed out willy-nilly... but there has got to be a more... efficient way. I love RP, I really truly do. Even I start to resent a char I feel I am putting a lot of time into that is 'stuck'. Maybe that is my fault as a player, but I tend to roll a character with something in mind. Not necessarily cabals and what not... but race and class are VERY basic things that we all make choices on at creation in my mind so I feel justified in having a qrace in mind at creation. When you are denied it sucks, but that was my fault... I didn't shine the brightest. When you are dumping energy and time into a character and are then told you weren't even denied... the application timed out due to a lack of decision, it is almost offensive to me that I am putting forth all I can... and you can't even tell me "thanks, but no thanks." I am sure this isn't the IMM's intent at all, just how it comes across to me.

[Kyzarius]

The system is definatly broken, and once you have played all the race/class combos...the game really becomes boring.

Yeah, I could sit and RP with myself in CC...or chase down hunting parties and try to spam them with emotes...or I could play another game.

Whats the fun in staring, bleary eyed, at my mud-client experiencing the feeling of being stuck in my characters development. *shrug*

[jibber]

Guess I'm the only one not seeing a broken system. Odd =/

[Dale]

It's not broken, though I really miss immortals like Raargant and Chayesh when they were very active and held lots of RP events. But, the imms are fair if you impress them they will reward you, if you expect or ask or just strait up act too cocky towards them it is within boundaries to get slain.

Ever been eaten?

[megayeah]

There was a time...long ago when the Ettin was experimenting with my charecters. I remember him slaying me in 14 different ways, hahaha.

[the_nightmare]

Guess I'm the only one not seeing a broken system. Odd =/

Of course you will not see a broken system, after you have played a three quest things in a roll without even so "shining" RP.

[f0xx]

Actually, most of Jibber's characters have been a shining example of good RP.

Zenophobynt, Zaulael, Valkynsra... hell take his most recent one - Istendil. Just because you don't have the RP to get a Qrace nowadays doesn't mean those who are getting them are cheaters.

[megayeah]

Have you seen my RP with Kimert? If you have tell me...did I deserve the demon? I was told that my RP sucks and I RPed my *** off all the time. I guess it really sucked, but most of the people I interacted with liked it. I will say it again 'THIS IS A GAME' I haven't gone OOC I trash killed a group only once and that happened at my 139 hour of waiting watching at the screen with the same people on and having nothing else to do but bring some CHAOS which was part of my RP. Perhaps Volgathras is right and I shouldn't have said to myself "This is boring", but that is not a good reason to reject me. I kept on bugging you...well, I waited more than anyone else that plays a demon has and I got rejected for being impatient. REAL FUN!

[megayeah]

Another thing. I suggest we stop posting about this cause we derailed the thread from it's begining.

[Evangelion]

Let's remember a couple things:

1) Half of peoples' "hours played" are falsified by world shifts.

2) If you didn't get what you were applying for, it means one of several things: a. You had a cookie cutter RP, that you didn't play off quite well enough; b. You had a unique RP that you didn't play off anywhere NEAR well enough; c. You did things in game that were not impressive to your immortal (trash killing, only killing people lower than you, etc.); or d. Some other reason that the immortal may or may not choose to share, most likely with you and you alone.

So, megayeah, rather than complaining about Kimert, why don't you either roll something new or take a break like you said you were going to. I would suggest the latter, because you have a lot of aggression pent up, and there is almost no productive way to integrate that into the game.

[megayeah]

You're wrong. I alread play a new charecter and I show no agression. As stated this is the Admins game and do as they see fit. I am not whining cause this is not over. I will not stop until I get the demon and next time I will wait 500 hours if I have to without asking a single stupid question.

[the_nightmare]

To be honest I never wanted anything quest, it is just because I don't like the waiting and I think that there is not anything quest that will make you more powerful.

[Dale]

I've seen Kimert's rp, and I wasn't a big fan of it. So many demon wannabes talk as if there are multiple voices, or use "we". It is fairly annoying, the idea that I have always believed was that you are a human, nothing more nothing less just a human seeking more, wanting to realize some potential. Or some other crazy idea you can muster up. But don't act as if you have it, don't roll your guy up going oh man I'll have this in 3 days easy. First off you have to wait 30 hours to put in the app, I have gotten both my demons well into 100 hours of human play time.

[megayeah]

I've never rolled a charecter that is to be a q-wannabe with the intention of being more powerful than the others. It has it's + and it has it's -. I roll a wannabe with the idea that I've never played such a thing and would be interesting to play something new when all the normal races/combos are no longer giving you satisfaction. Like when I got an undead monk...I got completely stomped upon by most of the pbase. I was better when I was still a human. But it was fun as hell, cause I played something I've never played before.

[Dale]

Also, if you get denied, that doesn't mean anything. Revise/rewrite your app maybe add some new rp aspects and get back on the wagon. One thing I tell me self and instill in my chars rp is that rejection will only make me try harder and be more patient.