f0xx Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 Valek, I read a few of your views on align/ethos combinations and they are so wrong I don't know where to begin even. I start to think that people shouldn't be able to choose them on char creation but they should be given to use by the immortals due to most of the PB heavily misunderstanding them, no matter whether this is intentional or not. Just a small explanation: Ethos has nothing to do with align. Align should be played as how people see you. Ethos is just how you behave in towns. In a forest there should be no difference between lawful good and chaotic good. They are just the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elfrosto Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 foxx- you blatantly say valek is outright wrong and then say something as ridiculous as "ethos is how you act in towns". thats just plain ignorant. ethos is how you act towards other characters and your rp! a chaotic character isnt going to give a crap about things a lawful character would, it has nothing to do with location its all about personality and attitude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f0xx Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 ethos is how you act towards other characters and your rp! You are partially correct. Ethos is how you behave in lawful areas i.e. do you obey the laws or not. Other than that, there is NO OTHER DIFFERECE between lawful good and chaotic good. Align is the major thing. Ethos is the minor. Ethos IS how you act in town, but the bigger frame is defined by align. That is why I make my comparison using lawful good and chaotic good, not lawful good and chaotic evil. It is like looking for a car: First criteria is brand Second criteria is color (for example). What is the difference between a red BWM and green BMW? The color. You remove the color criteria though, and it's all BMW. The same is with characters. The point is that ethos matters only in towns. Of course there are many other criterias but the one major is align. What is the difference between major criteria and minor one. The minor one affects characters only in certain circumstances, but the major one affects it always. The only major criteria in aabahran is ALIGN. Then it is ethos, religion, cabal and lastly personal RP. All those minor criterias do not have to go out of the frame defined by align. If they do, this will result to your character being outcast. Of course, there come some problems from this, but that is only because our game doesn't have a perfect system, and that is only because world is not perfect and perfect things don't exist I.e. a lawful good is allowed to attack and execute wanted goodies. Which goes right against the major criteria that defines our characters and creates RP conflicts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imoutgoodbye Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 Valek, I read a few of your views on align/ethos combinations and they are so wrong I don't know where to begin even. I start to think that people shouldn't be able to choose them on char creation but they should be given to use by the immortals due to most of the PB heavily misunderstanding them, no matter whether this is intentional or not. Just a small explanation: Ethos has nothing to do with align. Align should be played as how people see you. Ethos is just how you behave in towns. In a forest there should be no difference between lawful good and chaotic good. They are just the same. ROFLMAO! Ah, thanks, I needed a good laugh, mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twinblades713 Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 I wouldn't say it like f0xx did, but he's on the right track. It seems many people are confused as to the proper understanding of align and ethos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f0xx Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 ROFLMAO! Ah' date=' thanks, I needed a good laugh, mate.[/quote'] Really Valek? You need a good laugh? Then you should go back and re-read YOUR OWN post. Chaotic Good - Individualistic. Leans towards the "darker" side of good. Neutral Good - Works towards the Good of the Majority, the Greater Good. Lawful Good- Upholds laws, tries to find leniency in them, but still obeys the laws. Chaotic Evil - Worst of the Evils Neutral Evil - The "Hidden" Evil. Lawful Evil - Idealistic, Twisted Honor, but the "least" of all evils. Can be worked with. Chaotic Neutral - Minotaurs. Enough said there. Lawful Neutral - Zealots come to mind. Neutral Neutral - The halfling getting his smoke on and chatting with the Wizard. I have marked those that you got COMPLETELY wrong. I am not saying that your understanding of the others is completely true, because you still don't realize what ethos means, but your general understanding of them (those not marked in red) is ok...ish. There is no such thing as darker side of good in FL. There is just good who obeys laws in lawful areas (lawful), such that doesn't care about laws (neutral), and such that simply ignores them (chaotic). I will repeat it one last time in hope that you, and Efrosto understand it. The only difference between chaotic and lawful (no matter whether goods or evils) is their beahaviour in lawful areas. You can try to understand it or you can ignore/laugh, but that is how it is. And while we are on the subject I think we need a better "help ethos" file. One that states in directly, "This determines how you act in lawful areas", so we don't have people like Valek who use the "darker side of good" metaphor... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pali Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 Foxx is right. Ethos is, at it's simplest level, whether or not you will follow Tribunal laws. In general one can extrapolate certain character traits from their level of willingness to follow the law, and I think that it is superior RP to view ethos as reflecting a bit more about your character's level of concern for social rules in general than only Tribunal laws (does your char follow their own society's rules but not Trib's? Neutral ethos makes sense then. Does your char only follow their own personal code? Chaotic)... but going simply by literal definitions of terms, Foxx has it right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mya Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 chaos evil vs lawful evil is like jack the ripper vs hitler/palpatine. chaos is quality , order is quantity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f0xx Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 And batman is chaotic good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imoutgoodbye Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 I understand ethos. Your scope on it is simply too limited. Those are GENERAL examples from my point of view where I have it "wrong". And, no, we don't need new help files. Ethos at its most basic INVOLVES the law, but is not the end all be all of ethos. Ethos also includes religion, society, idealogies, etc... You can turn it down to basics. I don't recommend that. That assuredly promotes cookie-cutter RP. Ethos creates the variety amongst alignments. Alignment is the ultimate factor, but ethos ALLOWS characters to tip the scales around a bit, gives them more freedom in their choices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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