Guest emp_newb Posted July 30, 2007 Report Share Posted July 30, 2007 Hell, give me a trained ogre warrior with a few venom sacks and a power staff. I do not give two craps about the gear, Mithril/tained would do the trick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mya Posted July 30, 2007 Report Share Posted July 30, 2007 You know, that works both sides. And Vamps can get nifty AC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zrothum Posted July 30, 2007 Report Share Posted July 30, 2007 Oh yeah?! OH YEAH!? OH YEA MYA?!?! Well.......ur mom. =) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudder Posted July 30, 2007 Report Share Posted July 30, 2007 Mya: A Decked Warrior/Ranger ogre will definitely be able to kill a decked Vampire. I played Sirican and had to go up against Thandaeus(sp?) quite often. It was almost impossible for me to kill him once he got decked. In fact, I didn't do it more than twice. I hear Vamps were much stronger in the past, but honestly now, their biggest strength is that people usually give up in the beginning because "Vamps are overpowered." Though that only works against a novice player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zrothum Posted July 30, 2007 Report Share Posted July 30, 2007 Did you fight him pre-elder though? Elder makes a big difference for Thandaeus vs a vamp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudder Posted July 30, 2007 Report Share Posted July 30, 2007 The entire time I was elder me and Thandy did not fight... Then someone started a demotion vote and I lost elder, thus never getting it back. Yeah I know me being Elder would have changed a LOT... But that was only because he relied too heavily on a certain something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kahlos Posted July 31, 2007 Report Share Posted July 31, 2007 Fully trained decked dwarf blm avatar elder WM.. ouch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cephirus Posted July 31, 2007 Report Share Posted July 31, 2007 I think it would be interesting if vampires and liches were more like avatars, in that they receive different benefits dependant on the race/class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evangelion Posted July 31, 2007 Report Share Posted July 31, 2007 Vampires -have- received a significant power decrease. With my first vamp, Kevoniki, I trashed ogres, regardless. I killed Grunge, Despiser's ogre warrior WM (not sure if he was still WM at that point though) with ease. With my ogre warrior warmaster Grom, Sirican couldn't touch me. When we first went to war with Nexus, I raped him up, down, and two ways from Tuesday, . There is still one redeeming quality to vampires, which I personally think is ridiculous, and have brought to the attention of the immortals. If they were to change that, and bring back a little more of the vampires other powers, then I could see some balance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRins Posted July 31, 2007 Report Share Posted July 31, 2007 so Ceph...did you just campaign for different vamp powers based on race/class selection? I'm pretty sure that something different is coded for every possible vamp race/class... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tantangel Posted July 31, 2007 Report Share Posted July 31, 2007 Someone told me Avatars couldn't become Elders/Leaders of Cabals for this reason a couple weeks back I didn't realize there was a post about it though. Any particular reason as to how an Avatar could/would become an Elder/Leader of a Cabal aside from being in Herald? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pali Posted July 31, 2007 Report Share Posted July 31, 2007 so Ceph...did you just campaign for different vamp powers based on race/class selection? I'm pretty sure that something different is coded for every possible vamp race/class... As in, if you're not a human dk you can't be one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raargant Posted July 31, 2007 Report Share Posted July 31, 2007 Vampires -have- received a significant power decrease. With my first vamp, Kevoniki, I trashed ogres, regardless. I killed Grunge, Despiser's ogre warrior WM (not sure if he was still WM at that point though) with ease. With my ogre warrior warmaster Grom, Sirican couldn't touch me. When we first went to war with Nexus, I raped him up, down, and two ways from Tuesday, . There is still one redeeming quality to vampires, which I personally think is ridiculous, and have brought to the attention of the immortals. If they were to change that, and bring back a little more of the vampires other powers, then I could see some balance. The latter is highly exaggerated; the former is a complete fabrication. Kevoniki was not made until years after Grunge was deleted (although I do recall snooping you killing a naked ogre warrior that I believe Despiser played; the name escapes me); Sirican was a brand new vampire tossed into the middle of a war against superior numbers and people with considerably superior equipment. Although vampires have received a power decrease since 1.0, the decrease is not tremendous (save for a single spell). Nor has there been a power decrease between Kevoniki and Sirican; or, for that matter, from months before Kevoniki all the way to the present day; the only 'decrease' of power is the change of the 'ray of truth' of good clerics to be doing light damage again, which is hardly a change to the class itself. I am not trying to berate you or bring you down; however, please refrain from exaggerating either the tonedowns of the class, or your own 'accomplishments' in an attempt to prove a point. With respect to the original discussion, there is no 100% 'hard and fast' rule for avatars to not become E or L. Generally, however, it's something we tried to avoid in the interests of balance; as Pali mentioned earlier, an avatar, done right, is probably the strongest combination/character in this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chayesh Posted July 31, 2007 Report Share Posted July 31, 2007 pwnage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cephirus Posted July 31, 2007 Report Share Posted July 31, 2007 so Ceph...did you just campaign for different vamp powers based on race/class selection? I'm pretty sure that something different is coded for every possible vamp race/class... Umm, I don't think so, only dark-knights can become a vamp, and they always get the same skill/spell set. Unless I am wrong, which I would not mind being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raargant Posted July 31, 2007 Report Share Posted July 31, 2007 You are correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRins Posted July 31, 2007 Report Share Posted July 31, 2007 I was very indirectly and poorly saying that only one r/c combo can be vamps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crucial Posted August 1, 2007 Report Share Posted August 1, 2007 Avatars really are that damn buff Only if you can get the first few pkills on your own though right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raargant Posted August 1, 2007 Report Share Posted August 1, 2007 Ability to PK is a pre-requisite of becoming avatar, as with all of the qraces (to a greater or lesser extent). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evangelion Posted August 1, 2007 Report Share Posted August 1, 2007 The latter is highly exaggerated; the former is a complete fabrication. Kevoniki was not made until years after Grunge was deleted (although I do recall snooping you killing a naked ogre warrior that I believe Despiser played; the name escapes me); Sirican was a brand new vampire tossed into the middle of a war against superior numbers and people with considerably superior equipment. I assure you that, at least in regard to the first statement, you are incorrect. Despiser revived Grunge after a long retirement, with another ogre warrior whose name escapes me at present, and both were in Warmaster. The reason in particular that I recall is that my Savant healer Sheval, who was then my outcasted bard Sheval made a nuisance of himself to both ogres. Further proof lies in the character's record: Plathar : 1 0 0 (Plathar, a Justice character toward the end of the Justice cabal's existence, who I believe may have made it into Tribunal after its creation) Zelvhaeth : 2 1 0 (A character who was not around until Cariousus' time, well after Grunge would have supposedly been deleted) Noid : 2 0 0 (A character that has been spotted recently, and would have been deleted long ago from inactivity if Grunge was deleted "years" before Kevoniki) Kevoniki was over two years ago. And I maintain that, seeing as how I feel I've gotten significantly better at PK since Kevoniki, and did not do significantly better with Andraxus, that either there has been a power decrease in vampires, the playerbase has vastly improved (and I mean -vastly-), or I still suck (yes, I know I'm opening the door on that one, so don't even go there). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L-A Posted August 1, 2007 Report Share Posted August 1, 2007 Perhaps you're not as good with vampires as you give yourself credit for? L-A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evangelion Posted August 1, 2007 Report Share Posted August 1, 2007 Perhaps you're not as good with vampires as you give yourself credit for? L-A Believe me, I'm not by any means saying I'm good with vampires. Behrens human whatever wiped the floor with Kevoniki's sorry ***. But the increase in general PK ability should account for something, and if anything, vampires seemed to have a lot less umph the second time around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raargant Posted August 1, 2007 Report Share Posted August 1, 2007 I repeat, you are categorically mistaken. Grunge was deleted at the same time that Despiser deleted Shendamarin, due to a spat he had with Thoclya, whom we had in place as Syndicate Immortal at the time. I recall this quite distinctly because Mhalador was quite annoyed about the deletion for some time. Both characters came before Cariousus (which was three years ago to Kevoniki's two), and you underestimate the longevity of Festorvian's illithid psi, Zelvhaeth. I would estimate the length of time between the deletion of Grunge and the creation of Kevoniki as anywhere from 1.5 to 2 years. It is an indisputable fact that Grunge was deleted well before the cross-over, whereas it was this current administration who gave you Kevoniki. As for your assertions about vampires and their changes, I can only say that both the first and second options do not seem likely at all, since you requested that I not pick the (infinitely more likely) third choice. (PS. Never try to debate FL trivia with me.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EyeSeeU Posted August 1, 2007 Report Share Posted August 1, 2007 Damn son, that was freaking awesome RAAR!!!! *tips his hat to RAAR while toasting a bottle of beer* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evangelion Posted August 1, 2007 Report Share Posted August 1, 2007 The only person who can answer for sure is Despiser. And that's not very likely, now is it? Oh, and finally... Grunge was clearly deleted AFTER Shendamarin, because Shendamarin was deleted when I played Seretha (Noted because when I played Seretha, I made the mistake of posting on the forums asking Shendy to stop raiding the Knight Castle, because I couldn't keep up with the raids), who went on to later go to Winter with Grunge. The reason I recall this is because he decided we were taking too long to kill the Baron, and ended up killing it himself. As I said, Grunge made a reappearance with another ogre warrior whose name began with S (I believe this character was played by Stredon), and preceded the appearance of Rompkei by a few weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.