Warriors/Zerks

[Deykari]

Zerks can be fun to play but I regret choosing path of devastation. If you rage with that path you have to be 100% sure you're going to win (or that they're going to flee), otherwise you're dead. Unless you want to take chances fumbling about removing weapons and shields midcombat just to quaff a recall (that you might fumble a drop, whilst losing valuable defences/attacks by removing weapons/shields). Zerks are pretty much offensive characters so tick timing for quick sleeps is a vital skill for Zerks more than anyone in my opinion. You need to be constantly pummeling them with damage, and you can't be unletting, so timing that tick for a quick nap for your HP is vital so you can just keep on them as often as possible.

Plus, if what I heard about the hit/dam rage bonuses for the paths is true, it makes path of devastation almost completely pointless. Having only played one Zerker to pinn I don't know though. There are a lot of things behind Zerks, and I didn't find them all out in the short space I played at pinn. For example, in all my fights at pinn, I only ever cleaved two weapons. And we're not talking about them having burnproof ones, I'm talking a common staff or two handed sword whilst I was wielding a heavy two-handed axe/polearm. Apparently there was a reason behind why I never was cleaving but I didn't ever find out what it was.

What I found was, that because Zerks are highly offensive, with not the best defensive capabilities ever, battles quite often end up being hard and fast as opposed to long, slow and drawn out. Even long battles with Zerks usually end up with people fleeing wounded to sleep heavily wounded and return (either Zerk or opponent). It's this reason that it makes Zerks harder to play IMO; with a class like a shaman, your battles are long and drawn out. You can (sometimes) afford to make a mistake here and there, knowing you can get away, cure/sleep/whatever and continue. With a Zerk, in a fast battle, you have to do everything near damn right, straight off the bat against a good player.

Dey

[Raargant]

1) Rage is an integral part of zerkers. Knowing when to rage, and when not to rage, shows the skill level and competence of zerk in question, and is a matter of both skill, as well as experience.

2) Paths have bonuses aside from hitdam.

[Grumpy]

You have a point Raargant, but when most of the pb (including me) feel that zerks need a boost somewhere, its a good sign that they might very well need a boost. At least I hope this thread continues and we get some good suggestions.

[Mister E]

I have pinned both an anger zerk and a devastation zerk. The difference in hit/dam as I recall was not as much as I thought it would be. Blood haze is great, when ti kicks in, I like that comment someone made "you dont play zerks, they play you" heh. As for cleaves, on my anger zerk I trained them both to 100% and I didnt fail very often at all. Problem is there are ways to burn proof weapons and some weapons also cannot be cleaved.

If I had to make one change to zerks I would have it so when you rage and then stop raging (whether by fighting, or by it timing out) you do not lose the hp you gained. I know there would have to be some tweakage so that people cant abuse rage and use it as a massive heal by killing bunny rabbits, but since rage is so essential to a zerk it sucks when half the time you die after you kill your opponent. And since you cant flee when you rage it would also give you a chance to survive those close calls with centaurs and what not because even when you win you dont all of a sudden drop dead.

[Boy Kid Wonder]

If I were to make changes to zerk it'd be this:

Remove panic all together. The fact that you can't sleep when your opponent flees only makes it harder. They regen, you don't. Yes they have the skill regeneration which helps even it out more, but you can't sleep and you gain very little hp in comparison to what you would have if you could sleep. Every class can blind in SOME way. Every class can make it to where you cannot sleep.

Rage is on all or nothing thing. You're pissed off and you want them dead. You lose too much when you rage though. If you're not already winning it can do very little to help the situation. So you do more damage. But you take more. You can't sleep, they can. You attack random crap if not careful, so you can't chase really quickly. I'd either up the damage by rage or give a little bit more defense. You're mad, you're not dumb. Yes reckless, but not to the point where you don't care.

Mister E has an alright idea with the hp thing. Its ALOT of hp though. I've had pinned ogre zerk devastations that when raged/berserked have over 2k hp. Thats a TON. And to keep that is a bit much.

[Mister E]

What I meant is lets say you gain 500 hp when you rage, when you kill your enemie or rage ends your max hp will obviously go back to normal, but the 500 you gained when you raged shouldnt go too. Lets say you have 800 of 1200 hp and you rage in the fight, now lets say you have 1200 of 1600, you fight for a while and soon you are down to 600hp and your enemy is at awful and flees, then rage ends boom all of a sudden you are at 200 hp. Maybe you should only lose half or something...I know for the perma rage its ok because only when you kill your opponent will you feel the loss of hp all of a sudden, but mainly what I think sucks for zerkers is when they win the fight then die right after. Maybe just throw in a clause so that if they do win they cant go below 1hp, or get suffer a slight stun if they would have lost enough hp to go into the minus...

[Chayesh]

Hmmm...interesting idea.

[Raargant]

I actually like that idea.

[Chayesh]

I actually like that idea.

You sound surprised.

[Mister E]

Can Raargant get a 5 day forum ban for that hidden flame?

[Behrens]

Path of Anger zerk:

Fight weak mob:

Rage, relax, rage, relax, rage, relax.

Good thing I just healed to full faster than an elf healer on slow.

Retaining HP after rage isn't happening.

I actually considered that when I was looking at zerks with Aetharian and Srunc. (Path of Anger with Aeth, Devastation with Srunc).

I honestly think that zerks are the most balanced and interesting melee class right now.

[Iyorvin]

SHOT DOWN! Hehe, I told you!

[Mister E]

Yeah, after I wrote that I realized the potential for free heals and I agree.

But what about not dying when you kill your opponent or enemy. In other words nothing changes except that if you win the battle but losing rage would drop you below 1hp you go to 1 and get a short stun instead.

[Behrens]

If you go below zero, you get a system shock save to remain at -2 hp regardless of how low below zero you went.

One tick at -2 and you will be able to move around again just fine.

The odds of a dwarf failing said system shock save are less than 1 in 100. Just FYI.

[Iyorvin]

Really..........mmmmmmm

[Boy Kid Wonder]

Mister E just got owned.

http://Mister%20E.justgotowned.com/

[Chayesh]

Some of those images are just disturbing and wrong.

[Boy Kid Wonder]

Should I take it down? I thought it was kinda funny.

[Chayesh]

I'm just warning people.

I'm like the Surgeon General of Taste.

[Mister E]

LOL, Im impressed, and quite flattered. You went to a lot of trouble for li'l ol' me

[crackwilly21]

Ahhh, reminds me of something my brother would do...anyone remember Big Mac?

[Chayesh]

How is that old corpsehumper?

WARNING: TOTAL DERAILMENT DETECTED....attempting to topic shift...

[Zrothum]

I remember Big Mac! BWahaha....haven't played CZ in quite awhile. I was looking at all of Adam's pics from his trip to Europe...totally rad....I need to get him to roll something new.

[Pieman]

What if zerks were allowed to continue to dodge while raged, just like a -50% penalty of their normal dodge skill. That's what truly ruins you and makes you a large man in prison named Bubba's nightly slice. And nearly all of the zerks played (except maybe one) have such low dex that they're basically never gonna defend much anyway.

[spiegel06]

The thing of raging is that you care not what happens, you go all out taking in little consideration about defense.

That is why you need to know how to play one decent enough to play one well.