Implementor Erelei Posted May 4, 2015 Implementor Report Share Posted May 4, 2015 Without legitimate proof showing that materials are as easy to get as you say they are (without huge returns from hours and hours of mastering skills) it will be extremely hard to tell me it's overpowered, and I won't be changing it. However. As stated before. Logs. Logs. Logs. I can't say it enough. Back your claim with something concrete instead of this claim from people who refuse to give any evidence except their complaints. I'd be MORE than happy to balance or fix anything the staff and I deem overpowered from those logs and/or suggestions (backed with logs) if we find them so. So far, with all the snooping I've done, and yes, I've snooped literally every bard since the creation of them, the things I've seen as overpowered or overlooked were immediately fixed - and those that I didn't see were backed with logs and fixed as well, with the patience of said players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f0xx Posted May 4, 2015 Report Share Posted May 4, 2015 There's a silly amount of speculation in this thread. The class needs more time indeed. They look strong on paper, but so far, none of the existing bards have made any big impression, unless we count the massive amounts of note spam they are creating. The only thing I am certain about is they need to lose steal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trick Posted May 4, 2015 Report Share Posted May 4, 2015 I've fought several bards. Its not speculation from my standpoint. Though, I do agree that steal is just another thing that puts them over the top. A sleep you can't save against because you can't get saves against their spells.. and then they can mal/steal? Kinda rough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Implementor Erelei Posted May 4, 2015 Implementor Report Share Posted May 4, 2015 You can save against it with saves versus spell (which there's PLENTY of by the way). There are also other items out and about with saves versus breath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trick Posted May 4, 2015 Report Share Posted May 4, 2015 I'm pretty shocked that you're defending them this hard. You are a pretty good PKer yourself and you're going to tell me that they need all the shit they have? Really? I'm ALL for the revamp of the class. I think its awesome. I was probably one of the biggest advocates FOR the revamp, but to make the blatantly overpowered? Giving them high melee output w/ mals and high damage skills? That is strong. But they can sleep, steal, and mal you up before the fight even starts? Then, if you manage to get the upper hand in combat, they can heal.. Come on man.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Implementor Erelei Posted May 4, 2015 Implementor Report Share Posted May 4, 2015 Hi. I asked for logs. I didn't say I wasn't going to work on balance if I deemed then unbalanced. Gimme logs. Back your statements. Your PK knowledge alone does not warrant logless changes. I'm sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trick Posted May 4, 2015 Report Share Posted May 4, 2015 Fair enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Posted May 4, 2015 Report Share Posted May 4, 2015 In all fairness, if you are asleep you can't hear their songs. As a bard hater (And still hating since FF4 Damn you Edward) I am against the class change all together, I think other classes and cabals needed it far more. Every one was all like, yay bard change, now look at you. You sissies. Mya, you are the only one defending them I have noticed, have you played one? Have you fought one? I have no logs, I have only opinions which I will continue to keep to myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imoutgoodbye Posted May 5, 2015 Report Share Posted May 5, 2015 No one said you had to keep them to yourself. Just not present them as anything other than opinion or suggest changes need to be made from the opinion. Please continue, I'm still amused and I'm enjoying watching Morlhach hold the pragmatic high ground over the inductive charging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajwetton Posted May 5, 2015 Report Share Posted May 5, 2015 I can't totally speak about the combat prowess although in PVE yes they have a great output which is refreshing to have that utility/dmg considering honestly how much i hated them pve when i had my demon bard. in reguards to instruments ive been spamming compositionalist for a day now, gathering then building then tuning then getting rid of, i've worked maintain some and its fairly grueling, maybe its cause of the influx of bards currently or its because i dont know the "best" places to look but its definitely a time investment to get the skill points up to min/max a weapon. on a side note, morl the bard changes are amazing, i know you'll do the required tweaking as far as the levels of things but the amount of utility/flavor they have now is great and its honestly what i've idealized bards as for some time. these changes brought me back to the game. great work man you and all the staff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhurong Posted May 5, 2015 Report Share Posted May 5, 2015 I've watched numerous bards do more damage than my fire giant berserker, raged, wielding a fire weapon. I've seen as far as up to *** DEMOLISHES *** four times a round with what seems to be almost no defense against it. I dont get hit the same amount by warriors or anything else, except maybe a blademaster. Just my 2 cents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mya Posted May 5, 2015 Report Share Posted May 5, 2015 Mya, you are the only one defending them I have noticed, have you played one? Have you fought one? Had 2 pinacled ones, and was submitting PK logs on them while you were all rolling.Once the half the who list became bards, and they lost spells I teleported to other projects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Posted May 5, 2015 Report Share Posted May 5, 2015 Their spells sucked anyway. Why are you so mad they lost them? Bards are not spell casters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaerick Posted May 5, 2015 Report Share Posted May 5, 2015 Lol. "Please fix bards! Bards are weak! Bards are underpowered!" BARD CHANGES "GAH! These are op! Too strong! Bard's suck! RAWRRAWR!!!" lol. That's how I see this. Guys, any time a big change goes through it's gonna take time to even it out. This is compounded by the fact that since there was a change, everyone and their brother rolled one. After awhile, there will be both: balancing on the bards, and fewer people rolling them. So. Until then, keep calm and submit logs of things you think are off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f0xx Posted May 5, 2015 Report Share Posted May 5, 2015 Just theoretically speaking, how do you prove with a PK log that steal is OP? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Forsaken Posted May 5, 2015 Report Share Posted May 5, 2015 Just theoretically speaking, how do you prove with a PK log that steal is OP? You don't. Because it isn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Posted May 5, 2015 Report Share Posted May 5, 2015 Steal is only broken with moderate characters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magick Posted May 5, 2015 Report Share Posted May 5, 2015 I have no comment on bards with ranged weapons. Sorry. I don't have enough experience with bards to have a valid opinion. Steal is fine. Thieves are fine with steal. Bards are fine with steal. Smurf bards and thieves are fine with steal. Steal is not overpowered. Steal is not broken. Smurfs who steal are not overpowered nor broken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f0xx Posted May 5, 2015 Report Share Posted May 5, 2015 What about steal on invokers? Druids? Paladins? Can your give your professional opinion on those, Magick? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magick Posted May 5, 2015 Report Share Posted May 5, 2015 I refuse to dignify that with an answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mmm Coffee Posted May 5, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 5, 2015 I was stating that ranged weapons seemed to be the one thing making their output over the top. But maybe I should play one to 50 and find out for myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imoutgoodbye Posted May 5, 2015 Report Share Posted May 5, 2015 The only issue I've ever seen with steal is that people hate it when: A) There's a really good thief around.B ) There are a bunch of thieves around.C) (Current) Bards are stealing. Because: A) The other player didn't "earn" it (win by PK)B ) Another player has it and they can't get it back easily. (main difference between steal and rare crumble).C) Steal makes Bards OP (so does tarot cards, ranged weapons, and dirt kick. And the Nimble perk) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mali Posted May 5, 2015 Report Share Posted May 5, 2015 Except to the folks who get their backpacks and boats stolen while in the ocean! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trick Posted May 5, 2015 Report Share Posted May 5, 2015 The issue with steal and bards is they are very formidable in straight up combat. With their high damage vogues, weapons only bards know, and their songs they do not need to steal from their opponents to set up a win like a thief may need to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fool_Hardy Posted May 5, 2015 Report Share Posted May 5, 2015 boats can be worn, water steal is a non issue in regards to bards, bards can not pry. in regards to weapons only bards know its an easy fix, but I thought it already existed (I may be wrong here). Parry vs. Instrument = Parry vs. Exotic. In recent PVP (sparring) with my bard a certain blademaster had no trouble with parry and he was wielding maces. So I am not certain that parry comments hold water. On Topic: I will challenge a few warmasters and submit logs. I do not believe I should be able to win, with or without a bow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.