Identification List

[Ambroas]

Been keeping a record of this and will be adding more items to the wiki this weekend.  Before I do I was curious if anyone had IDs they'd like to donate so we can add more to the item list.  It's a great tool for new players who need something and is the best way for them to know where to go or what to look for so I'd like to see it completed.

[Tempirion]

I'd completed a huge update to the wiki already.  Start making a list of what needs to be added and I'll get with you to help finish it.

[Ambroas]

I'm kinda new to equipment and don't know what's missing.  Usually I just search for the new things I've found and add ones I can't find there.  Maybe we can get a list from the vets though.

[kamikazi]

There's a list of ID's in the wiki? 

[Magick]

I've got some lists.  I have been extremely lazy in compiling them into one as well, removing quest/qstuff items and whatnot.  Some of the information on these lists can be out of date, or from a different MUD (from people's AR days) in the case of some ID's I've seen talked about.  But I can send them over in a pastebin anyway to whichever of the @Immortals want them, though various items might be redundant.  I know @Ithric mentioned something in the past about if people want to help to PM him.

Except the Imms are in a much better position to get current and accurate ID's of items.  Something akin to:
#LOO 1,10000 {oload %{i};identify 1.;eat 1.;#WAIT 500}

This however, would put a lot of work on the Imms, even though the extraction is the easy part.  The way the wiki is currently set up, manually entering all those items is a colossal task.  A dozen or two items at a time from a dozen or more people is fine the way it's set up, but there's no way for a large infomation dump.  And I'm not sure there's an easy solution for that.  After all, my own z/CMud database is a work in progress just setting up the extraction code for the information listed, though that may be in part due to sloth.  And by in part, I mean pretty much the only reason.

The other bit is some of the items on the wiki are done either incomplete or seemingly haphazardly.  Missing item levels, outdated or obsolete information, mob name, partial lists, nonsense items such as everyone's favorite faceplate "z" or the memorable "zszbuopwpr" axe, which might be a mis-entered Nebula Axe (either way, it's a train wreck), etc.

 

The problem is that I believe the entire item list on the wiki needs an overhaul, be it updating or starting again from scratch (as it may be easier).  A complete list of armor and weapons onto the wiki would be preferable.
However, I'm more than happy to assist, be it with item extraction and/or data entry.  While the ability to do mass-entry would be welcome (even if it's in a source editor type of system), I could plug in items a few at a time when I get free time.

 

@kamikazi Here.

 

 

 

[FatMike]

I don't have many IDs but I'll help with data entry or if need be give me an area and I'll get the info for it(if I can actually manage to kill anything with a high level mage).

[Gaunticles]

I was wondering instead of just a bunch of random items can we get full lists of end areas in the game? For example, asylum, 3 factions, dischord, desolation.

[mya]

If this was really a priority, Morl would just make a tool to just to iterate the area files objects and extract the items and then push them into some sort of database.
In my opinion this kind of lists are a players thing. Finding items and exploring stuff is part of playing the game, having the game give you a list, id and locations of best items is .... in my opinion ... taking a part out of the game.

[sarcon]

46 minutes ago, mya said:

If this was really a priority, Morl would just make a tool to just to iterate the area files objects and extract the items and then push them into some sort of database.
In my opinion this kind of lists are a players thing. Finding items and exploring stuff is part of playing the game, having the game give you a list, id and locations of best items is .... in my opinion ... taking a part out of the game.

 

I would have to disagree. Being able to have access to this information is what actually helps me explore and keeps me going. Anytime I considering making a toon, I think about what type of armor/weapons/stats would be ideal for my play style and start planning. I would then look on the wiki, write down everything I need to get and start exploring. If you don't have this information  accessible to everyone, then your giving all the power to a specific group of people. This game is 95% about armor, equipment set up and weaponry. The better your armor is the better you can fight. The more knowledge you have about useful items, the greater the advantage. If everyone has access to this information, then everything starts coming down to skill and how you leverage the available information. This is 2016 and almost 99.9% of any game you play has a wiki with every item, quest, level, objects, weapons, armor and whatever else you need to disect the game. They don't have a "shhh, don't tell people where the really good stuff is" section. If you want to talk about what kills a player base or discourages people from playing, it's not knowing where things are and getting owned by those who do. 

[Magick]

Meanwhile, inexperienced players are further at a disadvantage as they have no idea what some of the mid-tier equipment does much less the high end, nor where to get it as they're never on the mob itself but always changing hands between top-tier players and as such, will never be able to see them, except on the receiving end or the odd chance that they're allowed to hold the items if and only if they're not nodrop.  And that's assuming they even know about the item in the first place.

Not everyone has an eidetic memory, takes notes on or logs every ID they come across.  I know I didn't for the first decade.  The elitism that we had in the first years in many ways actually prevented me from growing.  Not everyone can solo their way through Winter or Desolation or Gear and would certainly be hesitant on even attempting without a moderate set of armor to begin with, which leads us back to the beginning.

Additionally, it's only recently that everyone has access to identify as not everyone plays a mage.  With RPs you can now buy the identify spell, but not everyone can afford it; Brambus is great, but can't ID some items like those that are antineutral or nodrop; and Lore helps but isn't perfect, but has the advantage of being the only skill or spell in game that tells you which area said item is in, but comes with the caveat that you need to be holding the damned thing to begin with.  Locate Object is great that it tells you the mob or room it's in/on, but a lot of good it does for you if you have no idea what "A gold ballgown with petal-like tiers is carried by Daeven" is, does or where Daeven is.

No.  What you're saying is that you're forcing people to go explore a game with over 20,000 rooms (according to TMS - VOTE) and countless mobs that may or may not have items on them or that the average player can even beat alone to compile a database on their own for their own use before they can properly dress themselves.

It's not asked that the game compile its own database that a player in game can access or be forced upon them as they enter a zone.  "The Titanium Fullplate is in.  Would you like to warp there?  [Y/N]"  It's also not asked that detailed directions are given for a piece of equipment.  Far from it.  The wiki tells you which area and which mob, if any.  You still need to get there to get it.  It also tells you what the item is, allowing new players and old alike to find potential upgrades to their current armor set, regardless on if they're in or not.  All compiled by people who did what you and I did previous by trudging around those areas and ID'ing all those objects in an effort to help the little guy out.  You didn't have to discover Ohm's Law, Faraday's Law or Bernoulli's principle by yourself before you started to use it, did you?  No, it was found by one and shared among the many.

If you want to go the pure route and become an intrepid explorer to find new things out for yourself, knock yourself out.  Nobody's forcing you to use a tool at everyone's disposal.

[Pali]

7 minutes ago, sarcon said:

I would have to disagree. Being able to have access to this information is what actually helps me explore and keeps me going. Anytime I considering making a toon, I think about what type of armor/weapons/stats would be ideal for my play style and start planning. I would then look on the wiki, write down everything I need to get and start exploring. If you don't have this information  accessible to everyone, then your giving all the power to a specific group of people. This game is 95% about armor, equipment set up and weaponry. The better your armor is the better you can fight. The more knowledge you have about useful items, the greater the advantage. If everyone has access to this information, then everything starts coming down to skill and how you leverage the available information. This is 2016 and almost 99.9% of any game you play has a wiki with every item, quest, level, objects, weapons, armor and whatever else you need to disect the game. They don't have a "shhh, don't tell people where the really good stuff is" section. If you want to talk about what kills a player base or discourages people from playing, it's not knowing where things are and getting owned by those who do. 

Complete agreement.

[Gaunticles]

5 hours ago, mya said:

If this was really a priority, Morl would just make a tool to just to iterate the area files objects and extract the items and then push them into some sort of database.
In my opinion this kind of lists are a players thing. Finding items and exploring stuff is part of playing the game, having the game give you a list, id and locations of best items is .... in my opinion ... taking a part out of the game.

 

I would agree but I think pvp power equates to gear too heavily in this game and not having access to the vast tribal knowledge the vets have puts a burden too great on new players or even some mediumish players like myself.

literally just became aware of spell lvl gear this year, had no idea people are getting over 60 dam and hit or 700 ac. 

[Kyzarius]

Yeah would hate to have to play the game for years to learn that stuff. 

[Ambroas]

I'm not experienced enough to say gear is too strong of an influence so I'll leave that topic to people with more knowledge.  But I will say that it is an insane learning curve to learn the gear in this game which is why I try to help the wiki when I can.  I know you were all new at one time but honestly it seems like almost everyone here has been playing for almost a decade or more with a small group of 1-3 that are newish time wise.  Maybe I'm wrong but that's how things come across.

That being said without a proper list of gear where people know where to go for upgrades I don't see many completely nlew people with no ooc connections staying in the game.  Say someone gets to 50 and is wearing black steel armor, they get asked to go to gear with some mages and manage to get adeptus legs.  This person then comes back glad they now have a piece of good gear to be PK'd by the first Melee who sees them and loose the legs.  Now they hopefully logged the trip for directions but aren't strong enough to go alone so they have to wait for a new group.  I've experienced this and what it lead to was me only playing characters who could hide/camo/gate/druid gate.  I would completely avoid any player who came near and was alone most of the time because I was worried I'd loose my few good pieces before I could make a set good enough to stay in a fight more than a few rounds and learn more on pk.  I'd only approach people in my cabal, other goodies or people pk restricted. 

Now I don't want to tone down the difficulty or restrict pk, I've sugguested just getting rid of the rare system and keeping unique but that was a no.  A list like what's on the wiki though is great.  I search for helms find one better than what I have and try that area until I find it.  THen I upgrade my chest and so on then go back to helm.  Sadly though I think equipment learning will be the curve that cuts off most people.  People play lots of characters, people know all the gear so it goes from one hand to the other and never goes back to the mob unless it's a piece no one wants which there will be a reason why and it'll do the new guy nothing good to have then.