Poking my head in...

[Telufial]

yeah solo ranking doesn't look to paletable

[Kyzarius]

They are overwhelmed by the gear power creep.

 

Hit roll and saves are higher than ever before and cc classes suffer for it.  They are harder to pk with than ever.  

[f0xx]

31 minutes ago, Kyzarius said:

They are overwhelmed by the gear power creep.

Hit roll and saves are higher than ever before and cc classes suffer for it.  They are harder to pk with than ever.  

I'll politely disagree with you on that statement.

[tassinvegeta]

Wow that's a first. You POLITELY disagreed. Maybe I can go so far as to ask you to elaborate on those thoughts?

[Kyzarius]

Yeah I just cant withdraw my statement, I play those classes so much I alwyas have one active.

I have felt first hand the power creep for melee and hybrid as the new areas and gear have come in. 

I also have people pming me constantly desperatly asking for what they can do to even survive 4 rounds against most melees. 

[Telufial]

So hybrid or straight melee is the way to go now?  Like... rangers.

[Kyzarius]

pet classes are grossly overpowered in my opinion.

Currently if you attack someone whose pets are following them the pets all get 2 rounds of combat because of autoassist.  It is stupid.  the opening round can hit you for 200+ hp.

A caster casts any spell minimum lag time is 1 round, well they get hit by the ranger, and his pets hit 2x each.  Since cc have pretty weak defenses most times this does ~200+ hp in damage even with -600 to -700 ac (which is what I always have when geared and actively pking).  That is nearly ~20% of their hp just as a punishment for attacking them. 

Then add to it that they can melee with 50-60/50-60 hr/dr while carrying ~-40 spell saves when you combine spells to specific categories and you have the current state of the mud.  

Nobody has ever acknowledged, at least to me, that this auto assist behavior is a problem. 

 

So yes, straight melee staking hr/dr, rangers, and because of the autoassist crap necromancers, are over the top imo. 

[Zavero]

@Kyzarius, while I agree with you for the most part...you destroyed nearly all opposition as Lelleiala which is a caster, albeit a qclass with no pets except the knight pet.

I will agree that rangers can deal some ridiculous damage in one round to any caster.

[f0xx]

4 minutes ago, Zavero said:

@Kyzarius, while I agree with you for the most part...you destroyed nearly all opposition as Lelleiala which is a caster, albeit a qclass with no pets except the knight pet.

Someone else spotted the small  bias too.

It's like me or tassin saying DKNs are weak and need a buff.

Oh wait, he actually did say it some time ago.....

.....right before rolling his dkn....

[Kyzarius]

23 minutes ago, Zavero said:

@Kyzarius, while I agree with you for the most part...you destroyed nearly all opposition as Lelleiala which is a caster, albeit a qclass with no pets except the knight pet.

I will agree that rangers can deal some ridiculous damage in one round to any caster.

You cant compare psi to any other CC class in the game.  They have mechanics that actually address the power creep.  

AND Lelleiala was a Sigil, like 3 layers of % reduction there.   A single hit took a nearly 80% reduction in incoming damage to Lelleiala before AC even. 

 

So fine, give psi amp to all casters.  

 

and btw, rangers were the only ones that could take her down.  Even with all that their damage output was to much. 

[tassinvegeta]

How is it bias to play a class we actually admit are weaker than others? lol.

I think @Kyzarius and I can agree some mages may not be as susceptible to this topic as others? Psi's and Invokers just in my opinion.

My decision to roll certain combos lately are because I identify with them in an rp sense. I find them unique and challenging. They're usually in need of a buff or just had a buff which needs exploring. Not because I think they're top tier and want to roll the playerbase with ALL the time lol. But this is just my own personal perception.

Possible recent or intending combos

Fire Zerk (time to test out the new diminishing return changes)

Zerk Barbarian fury (would like to test the new barb trophies and find out what it's like to be able to cleave and disarm)

Undead DK (almost a whole new qrace to test. No more undead corpse problems yay. Also affected by saves issues so I'd like to see how viable they are)

Lotus scourge half-elf ninja (Very unexplored ninjitsu and the most fun to play)

Shadow arts ninja Pandemonium (I have my reasons)

These are all less popular choices but it's not going to stop me from trying them.

[Trick]

3 minutes ago, Kyzarius said:

You cant compare psi to any other CC class in the game.  They have mechanics that actually address the power creep.  

AND Lelleiala was a Sigil, like 3 layers of % reduction there.   A single hit took a nearly 80% reduction in incoming damage to Lelleiala before AC even. 

 

So fine, give psi amp to all casters.  

 

and btw, rangers were the only ones that could take her down.  Even with all that their damage output was to much. 

Well.. rangers and Belderon..

[Kyzarius]

hahaah fair fair sir.  That was such an awesome fight, close too. 

[Zavero]

I see your point. I admit that I do not know much about Psi. 

[Trick]

1 minute ago, Kyzarius said:

hahaah fair fair sir.  That was such an awesome fight, close too. 

I wish I would have noticed I didn't have sanctuary for almost half of it haha! Would have been more one sided I think

[Telufial]

1 hour ago, Kyzarius said:

pet classes are grossly overpowered in my opinion.

Currently if you attack someone whose pets are following them the pets all get 2 rounds of combat because of autoassist.  It is stupid.  the opening round can hit you for 200+ hp.

A caster casts any spell minimum lag time is 1 round, well they get hit by the ranger, and his pets hit 2x each.  Since cc have pretty weak defenses most times this does ~200+ hp in damage even with -600 to -700 ac (which is what I always have when geared and actively pking).  That is nearly ~20% of their hp just as a punishment for attacking them. 

Then add to it that they can melee with 50-60/50-60 hr/dr while carrying ~-40 spell saves when you combine spells to specific categories and you have the current state of the mud.  

Nobody has ever acknowledged, at least to me, that this auto assist behavior is a problem. 

 

So yes, straight melee staking hr/dr, rangers, and because of the autoassist crap necromancers, are over the top imo. 

 

Well damn, I have a level 50 ranger somewhere from a few years back... but I can't remember it's name.  Was a tribunal... bah.  I don't think I can be bothered to solo rank anything up to 50 right now

[Kyzarius]

of course again the autoassist giving 2 rounds worth of hits to a ranger or necromancers horde gets overlooked. lol. 

[Trick]

3 minutes ago, Kyzarius said:

of course again the autoassist giving 2 rounds worth of hits to a ranger or necromancers horde gets overlooked. lol. 

As one of the biggest ranger players in this game, I will agree that the opening rounds of rangers can be tough to deal with, for sure. Murder/flee was a HUGE tactic I used as Ekhurift, but it was more for my werebeast damage and less for the pets, but it DID help. So, on rangers/necromancers I will agree with you.

[Kyzarius]

I just dont know why this is left the way it is.  Just give them one round, thats it.  That opener is rediculous.  And a caster just has to sit and eat it. 

[Trick]

1 minute ago, Kyzarius said:

I just dont know why this is left the way it is.  Just give them one round, thats it.  That opener is rediculous.  And a caster just has to sit and eat it. 

I'll agree with that. I've won PKs strictly because of it.

Would you be willing to concede that wimpy(I know, I know, derail) is also abusable in the current set up?

[Kyzarius]

The problem with wimpy in my mind is it is a tool for newer players, but a Vet can use it too and more effectively. 

Do we drop it to punish newer players because of vets who use it? 

 

I know if it was taken out it would have literally no effect on my play-style.  

[f0xx]

15 minutes ago, tassinvegeta said:

How is it bias to play a class we actually admit are weaker than others? lol.

Because they are not?

Either way that's some very good command of language there lol.

So let me clarify this for you, 

It's bias because you both play certain combos with which you do very well, yet you both claim that those same combos are terribly weak. You even asked for DKNs to get +spell level buffs few months ago.

Kyz tries to make it look like PSI are exception to the rule, but he does well with not just PSIs. Necromancers, shamans, clerics, liches are all calsses he does extremely well with.

Tassin on the other hand says invokers are fine (I wonder why), so what mages are we left with?

Battlemages?

So yes, next time you two come here saying how weak "mages" are, make sure you exclude Invokers, Clerics, Shamans, Psions and Necromancers + all the hybrid classes (DKNs, Paladins and druids).

And we are left with battlemages. 

So you say battlemages are weak. I'll agree on that.

[Trick]

Just now, Kyzarius said:

The problem with wimpy in my mind is it is a tool for newer players, but a Vet can use it too and more effectively. 

Do we drop it to punish newer players because of vets who use it? 

 

I know if it was taken out it would have literally no effect on my play-style.  

Then perhaps leave it to moderate players or adventurers as it fits the role of providing newer/lesser skilled players a way to be safer?

I would even be in favor of letting vets have it too if it had a cooldown so you were forced to use it strategically.

[Kyzarius]

when Lelleiala was psi there were 5 other psi.  Name them. 

 

how about this too, send a shotout to Cyprian and ask him how his is going.  Same path as Viruthx. 

 

Just because I can take a class and end up with a nearly perfect pk record doesn't mean the average player can. 

 

If you balance the game around the players who specialze with certain classes @f0xx then you will make it impossible for the average player to get anywhere.  Which is exactly what is happening imo. 

[Kyzarius]

Hell, when I played Rathanous Liches got nerfed into the dirt because I was dominating so hard. 

There hasn't been a memorable Lich since I believe.  The most recent one actually earned some of the nerfs getting rolled back.