How old Is Abrahan?

[Iusedtobesomebody]

to WC: can you post anything without a quote? heh.

[WarriorCleric]

...Yes...

...I...

...can...

.

http://forum.forsakenlands.org/showpost.php?p=49834&postcount=14

http://forum.forsakenlands.org/showpost.php?p=49811&postcount=12

http://forum.forsakenlands.org/showpost.php?p=49631&postcount=32

http://forum.forsakenlands.org/showpost.php?p=49522&postcount=8

http://forum.forsakenlands.org/showpost.php?p=49242&postcount=4

http://forum.forsakenlands.org/showpost.php?p=49225&postcount=2

http://forum.forsakenlands.org/showpost.php?p=49153&postcount=15

http://forum.forsakenlands.org/showpost.php?p=49148&postcount=12

http://forum.forsakenlands.org/showpost.php?p=49136&postcount=3

http://forum.forsakenlands.org/showpost.php?p=48871&postcount=25

http://forum.forsakenlands.org/showpost.php?p=48870&postcount=16

http://forum.forsakenlands.org/showpost.php?p=48866&postcount=13

12 out of my last 25.

WC

[Iusedtobesomebody]

or using links?

[inscribed]

My advice, Icor, stop looking at this game as a job, and start enjoying it as a hobby. If everyone else can get along without percise knowledge of everything history related and enjoy themselves, you can too.

a-g

Whats wrong with wanting to know more about the history of the world you play in? I'm curious about it too.

[Warpnow]

Nothing is wrong with it. Search room and item descs. Check the herald library. Read as many helpfiles as possible. There is a good bit available if you just look for it on FL history, and there are some things on the new website that are useful.

Its there, if you look for it.

[Icor]

My advice, Icor, stop looking at this game as a job, and start enjoying it as a hobby. If everyone else can get along without percise knowledge of everything history related and enjoy themselves, you can too.

a-g

...All I am saying, really, is that a good book is never written with "Maybes" and "Fill in the Blanks, Mr. Reader, if you please".

[Raargant]

I'd disagree strongly. Good books often do exactly that, to make it more interesting; to give the idea that no one knows quite everything. For example, in Tolkien fiction, there are always enigmas, as Tolkien said, such as Tom Bombadil. In other classic fiction series, such as Wheel of Time, Shannara, etc. etc., there are plenty of things that no one really knows, a mythical 'elder age', or 'golden age', or whatever.

Regardless, refer to my post, or WC's quote of my post.

[Fiere]

Now, here's a lesson for you and everybody else here, a secret about arguing: if you want the last word, the ultimate last word, just say, "I'm just sayin'", and hold your hands up. Works every time.

[Warpnow]

Why compare a mud to a book?

They're not the same...

In a book, the book tells you what happens.

In a mud, you tell the mud what happens.

[Celerity]

I thought it was more like you interact with the preconstructed MUD world to make a world for yourself.

[Chayesh]

Why compare a mud to a book?

They're not the same...

In a book, the book tells you what happens.

In a mud, you tell the mud what happens.

So the next time the mud tells you the sun is rising, you go right ahead and tell it to stop. Then you can post a bug on the prayer forum when it doesn't obey you.

Oh that's right, you don't play any more.

[Raargant]

lol

Seriously though. Make something up that's reasonable, and run with it, as compared to the canonical version of the FL history.

[Icor]

Four truths:

1) Our characters are always fictional.

2) Our characters exist in a fictional world.

3) Fictional characters need foundation.

4) Fictional worlds need foundation.

My point is that fictional characters can believe and act however the please in the opposite way that they cannot, CANNOT take the foundation of the fictional world they belong to and warp it without altering someone or something else critical to continuity. Therefore us, as non-fictional people, need to know what is acceptable and natural for our fictional characters’ foundations to be.

I seriously hope I'm making sense here...

[Deykari]

Now' date=' here's a lesson for you and everybody else here, a secret about arguing: if you want the last word, the ultimate last word, just say, "I'm just sayin'", and hold your hands up. Works every time.[/quote']

Hahaha. Classic.

Dey

[Questioner]

...so like this?

"I'm just saying," says questioner while holding his hands up. Walks up, turns the computer off and walks away...Oh yeah!

[Crypticant]

I've done some research on this from some of my ancient logs and such, and here is the information you may be interested in:

Aabahran: The Forsaken Lands has a few "official" birth dates.

1) Official Date of creation: March 11, 2000 - "The Cursed Lands" opened on Athaekeetha's server for testing.

2) Official Date on oldest server: May 16, 2000 - "The Cursed Lands" was moved to the Tamarisk server, where it lived for about 4 years.

3) Official Date "The Cursed Lands" became "The Forsaken Lands": June 25, 2000.

4) Official Date of first Beta: July 1, 2000 - Aabahran: The Forsaken Lands opened for beta testing.

Since I consider the birth of FL to be the first time the mud started outside of AR, we'll go with #1. Based on that information:

Using SQL syntax (to easily illustrate this):

declare @days int

set @days = datediff(d, '3/11/2000', getdate())

print @days

@days = 2355

So, FL, as of today, is 2355 days old.

The way this breaks down into MUD time:

1 minute real time = 2 mud hours.

1 hour real time = 120 mud hours.

1 day real time = 2880 mud hours (or 120 mud days)

2355 days real time = 282600 mud days

Aabahran: The Forsaken Lands is 774 years and 89 days and 23 hours old (approximately).

So, hopefully that will give you an answer you were looking for.

[Iusedtobesomebody]

go Crypt

[Ex-D&Der]

When the MUD went live, Aabahran already had a history. So it's older than that.

[Raargant]

Things like the pwipe, aka 'world shift', wreck the timeline even more.

[Chayesh]

I can't believe this has gone on for seven pages...

This isn't some abstract concept. The "dates" in FL are recorded time. The world is in fact older. How is this confusing?

Obviously, things existed before someone actually started writing stuff down. There is your foundation, in completely liquid form, for any RP you could come up with.

[WarriorCleric]

From This I'd say it's atleast 2669 years old. But even;

the single oldest mention of a city refers to the town of Anduin buried below the city of Caranduin and assumed to be dating back to over 2000 BC.

And that's just the first created city. So I'd guess people probably lived before that.

WC

[Iusedtobesomebody]

in a world of 'timmy the powergamers', people need to know everything.

[Celerity]

WC: That even uses BC, which is a completely different (and assumably forgotten dating system--for ex. AD/BC do not line up exactly in our own calander) than what FL uses...so just by using that date, you might(99.999999%) have to significantly adjust the year.

As for Icor, yes -usually (esp. CLASSICAL style) fictional characters in fictional worlds need reasonable foundations. Almost always, except for the most richly detailed characters and worlds, it is implied. You have a reasonable foundation. You just don't have an exact number. Like everyone has been saying, it is more detailed info than we have on our RL world, and is more than enough to assumbly make an infinite amount of different char types. Read Mythago Wood..I think that story really outlines how FL is set up, regarding the legends and myths to physical manifestation.

Crypt: That dating method uses our dates, not FL's, and doesn't address older than 800 year old people. While FL's dates are derived (directly) from RL dates, that is only used for timeline PROGRESSION, not initialization. Even it was, your dating system is a bit off, as the FL calander doesn't exactly (with a wide derivation over even a few years, much less ~774) follow our RL lunar calander. Even if it did follow our lunar calander exactly, it would still be off, because Aabahran doesn't follow Earth's orbit (having multiple moons and being presumably a different size, in a different solar system, with a host of different specs). So, it would have vied way off your target date right from the first couple years, even if it had -initialized- from Earth's date AND calander. Also, the argument of standard time does not apply here, because days in FL are started and stopped by the local hour (which seems to be only a single (extremely variable and daily changing) time zone in FL, as the hour never changes based on location, and the sun always sets/rises at the same hour), so it would be even further off course than even the rest of my argument considered (also giving evidence of a differently shaped/inhabited/orbiting/physical conditions/etc world).

[WarriorCleric]

WC: That even uses BC' date=' which is a completely different (and assumably forgotten dating system--for ex. AD/BC do not line up exactly in our own calander) than what FL uses...so just by using that date, you might(99.999999%) have to significantly adjust the year. [/quote']

Um... BC: Before Cataclysm.

PC: Post Cataclysm

I have obtained this information from cryptical and hidden pages long lost to the FL community and countless hours of research funding by government grants. Or from here.

And from

This isn't some abstract concept. The "dates" in FL are recorded time.

I'm guessing BC time is the same as PC time, just prior too and after a very big event, one I suggest to be called: The Cataclysm.

WC

[Crypticant]

When the MUD went live, Aabahran already had a history. So it's older than that.

Yes, I realize that (because I wrote the original history [Prophecies of Damnil, etc], because no MUD opens live without a background story of some sort), however, that is "made up" history with little reference to actual dates.

You people wanted to know how old "FL" is, I gave a scientific answer based on actual dates of the Mud's origin. If you wish to use abstract and referential dates (such as dates pulled from the history that were "made up", then absolutely you will come up with a vastly different idea of how "old" the virtual world is.

As far as the orbiting planets and such, Celerity, that makes zero difference. The ROM calendar (which this MUD's calendar was based off of) is based loosely on a standard Gregorian calendar, with some differences. The main difference between the original ROM calendar and your everyday run-of-the-mill calendar is that the ROM calendar has 12 months, with each season being 3 months long, with 30 days in each month, which works out to a 360 day year for the MUD.

Now, if you want to make an abstract from the dates based on "recorded" history (which Viri, Ath, Latesh, and Alexander "made up" initially, and which was embellished upon over the years), then feel free. I was merely giving the relative age of the MUD based on the creation date, 6 years ago.