Why don't their hands just take the weapon class of whatever weapon they were wielding prior to transformation?
New weapon class: Natural
Werebeast Zerk PK log vs a Warrior with a staff.
http://www.theforsakenlands.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32422
H2H offense is fine. There is no need for changes to it.
The only place Were zerks lack is the loss of skills.
As they lose Charge, and Cleaves.
As of now, in my view. A dual wielding zerk is the same as a Transformed Werebeast ofence and defense wise. But the non transformed one gets to use skills like charge and cleaves.
They should get to use their claws to cleave weapons and definitively charge people. Just make it emote "XXX pounces on top of you." instead of "charges you".
Why don't their hands just take the weapon class of whatever weapon they were wielding prior to transformation?
That's not a bad idea. Another option is to make their attacks 'exotic' when transformed (due to the inherent offensiveness of this).
L-A
My original reason for posting this was a pk log of me vs f0xx's mino warrior.
I was raged around 80/80 hit dam and the entire fight hit him twice. dual wielding the least defensive weapons in aabahran while fighting the arguably the highest melee output class (barring pets) is inexcusable.
Morlach presents a good point, perhaps that weapon could ALSO reflect on their defenses. for example if you transform dual wielding axes, you take a slight penalty to your dodge, to prevent people from just dual wielding heavily enchanted throwing axes to retain maximum offense.
Werebeast Zerk PK log vs a Warrior with a staff.
http://www.theforsakenlands.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32422
H2H offense is fine. There is no need for changes to it.
The only place Were zerks lack is the loss of skills.
As they lose Charge, and Cleaves.
As of now, in my view. A dual wielding zerk is the same as a Transformed Werebeast ofence and defense wise. But the non transformed one gets to use skills like charge and cleaves.
They should get to use their claws to cleave weapons and definitively charge people. Just make it emote "XXX pounces on top of you." instead of "charges you".
Lol Mya that is not the best log to use to state that transforned werebeast zerks are fine.
I can tell from the log that the warrior is very poorly dressed and it is also a halfling... The zerk also spent most of the fight not dirt kicked which was a huge mistake on the warriors part. In the instances where the zerk was blind they were getting beaten handily round by round.
I did learn a couple things from that log though:
a) Zerks don't get dispel evil
even if they did it will never hurt a halfling
Everyone who claims that werebeasts zerkers, and werebeasts in general are fine, has little or no experience in playing the race.
Werebeasts are only fine as druids, and only the falcon dudes. Even then, one would probably be better as a human.
Their loss of defences and hand to hand attacks and the many more disadvantages don't make it for the innate haste you get when transformed. Not at all.
Everyone who claims that werebeasts zerkers, and werebeasts in general are fine, has little or no experience in playing the race.
Werebeasts are only fine as druids, and only the falcon dudes. Even then, one would probably be better as a human.
Their loss of defences and hand to hand attacks and the many more disadvantages don't make it for the innate haste you get when transformed. Not at all.
After playing a werebeast(wolf) ranger, I was shocked at the power they have. Kadrinath showed us that they can be VERY strong and after playing a bit as a stalker wolf ranger, I agree with him. That's not to say that they are better than other races, but not necessarily weaker.
The only thing Kadrinath proved, was that he can hit hard. And that shouldn't be a surprise, considering how much dam roll he had.
As for your zerker, considering the quality of your other characters, I wouldn't say he proved anything either.
No offense.
I liked the suggestions made by Filth, L-A and Mya... with 100 percent in transformation, the werebeast should no longer auto-transform and their fighting style would, reasonably, be considered exotic. given the first two suggestions, there should be some skills not permitted while transformed (e.g. firedweapons) however, I think all the skills they lose should be revisited... and some they lose (charge) would be based on what transformation they had... so, a bear would keep the skill as is, a tiger would be gimped, but a falcon would lose it. making some transformations slightly better at one class or the other.
The only thing Kadrinath proved, was that he can hit hard. And that shouldn't be a surprise, considering how much dam roll he had.
As for your zerker, considering the quality of your other characters, I wouldn't say he proved anything either.
No offense.
Fought: 288 Won: 227 Lost: 61 Refused: 16
That's a pretty good record. Kadrinath did VERY well. Actually, F0xx..I can't think of a single werebeast you've played. I've seen you do a thousand DKs and duergar/dwarf blademasters and...well..thats it. So, your credibility in this is pretty much nothing.
It's not fair to put any success of a character on their equipment. He GOT that equipment and he KEPT that equipment. Testament to the player and the character.
Actually' date=' F0xx..I can't think of a single werebeast you've played.[/quote']
I guess that means I haven't played any then.
That were any good or memorable. Which, isn't necessarily your fault. Sometimes players just suck with certain things. I am awful at dark knights. You are not. Emp_newb is good at werebeasts. You suck with them.
While I think you are right that certain people suck with certain classes (although I believe it's more of a playstyle thing), I think we will both agree that werebeasts are lacking to every single other race (except humans).
Each of us can name many Ogre/Stone/Feral/Halfling rangers, and each of us can name many Mino/Fire/Ogre/Storm/w-e zerkers.
When it comes to werebeast ranger/zerkers, the only thing that comes to mind is Kadrinath.
And I would give that more to the fact that Emp has a very vast knowledge and experience when it comes to rangers, rather than as a proof of anything.
What werebeasts need mostly, IMO, is quality of life changes.
Like for example: They shouldn't transform randomly, there shouldn't be a timer to that transform, they should be able to get stuff in and out of their backpacks when transformed, they should be able to put sanctuary on them via the staff when transformed, the beast should finally be made selectable in the creation of the character.
I agree with you there. There have been way more successful rangers/berserkers that were different races than werebeast. I stand by my statement that wolf rangers are very strong, but I also agree with your point that they need a bit of quality of life changes.
Your ideas would make them much easier to play and make them more common, probably. Choosing their beast at creation isn't so necessary since the quest was put it, which is a fun little RP thing.
Personally, I would like to see the werebeast transformations overhauled and possibly amped up a bit. As it is now all we see are wolf rangers or falcon druids. My understanding of bear and tiger isn't so high, but I find them to be far less threatening then other two available options.
I'm not sure who suggested it a while back, but I am a fan of eliminating werebeasts as a selectable race and making them a Qrace. Beef them up considerably and make it special. As it is a "natural" or "earth-thing" it could be accepted into Warmaster as well. I think it'd be far better use of the concept of werebeast than it is now.
And I would give that more to the fact that Emp has a very vast knowledge and experience when it comes to rangers' date=' rather than as a proof of anything.[/quote']
Kadrinath was my third ranger, the first two where AWFUL. So I took a race I had never played, and went moderate. Trick has INFINITELY more exp with rangers than I do (still have not done another since kadrinath)
Kadrinath also had 60/85 hit dam as a moderate (you can see that in the pk of heiku vs. kadrinath, this was moderate pre cabal). Kadrinath shocked me VERY heavily, hence me applying to go from blue to red. I wanted to play a char I could learn rangers with, and turns out I just can't play ogre/stone rangers. I would love to say his success was solely because im amazing, but to be honest I think almost all of my victories from before I was T glad came half off the back of my opponent underestimating me, then once they realized their mistake, I was fast enough to close the deal before they could really recover.
I remember you having some beefy Ogre rangers in watcher....
shrug
I'm not sure who suggested it a while back' date=' but I am a fan of eliminating werebeasts as a selectable race and making them a Qrace. Beef them up considerably and make it special. As it is a "natural" or "earth-thing" it could be accepted into Warmaster as well. I think it'd be far better use of the concept of werebeast than it is now.[/quote']
I find this to be a very good idea.
I had grush. Warder ogre tracker. You can read a log of a shaman outmeleeing me 
I had grush. Warder ogre tracker. You can read a log of a shaman outmeleeing me
Yeah.
You can read a log of inductee slith warrior in WM destroying Dagoneto too 
If we are going to make a change to werebeasts, I like the exotic over h2h for weapon numbers while transformed. But I say we take it one step further. Let the werebeasts retain parry while transformed. Zerks have a heck of a time dodging anyway, making it the only defense by a random skill like transformation means that as a player you have to not only watch your enemy in battle but watch yourself. I always thought that since it costs exp to be a werebeast you should become more powerful when transformed, in truth, in most instances, transformation equates to a quick loss. All that being said, I love the werebeast race, I believe it has the most RP potential of any non q-race. I would hate to see it become a q-race where its numbers and thereby members would be limited.