Werebeasts

That's enough, thanks.

This is something under considerations by the staff. However' date=' I can't provide any details or when we might get this finished. I guess I can only offer the pitifully inadequate "We hear you, and we're doing something about it."[/quote']

Thanks for the info.

Also, never be afraid to say stuff to the PB, just because you might change your opinion latter. It better to say we are planing to do A, and latter say we did B because we changed our mind. Than to not say nothing and suddenly B comes out from unknown. Communication is great.

Also on were beast, what if:

You had the both of both worlds.

The choice of race including the choice to be random. Add a slight perk to random choice like auto-adventurer perk as RP reward. Please never add a PK advantage to a RP choice, because it would them become mandatory. IE veteran plays would always take the random because of the bonus and we would be back to the start.

We can also RP the race selection in a certain way. Like linking the room type where you make the selection to the beast type. Forests get wolf, mountains bear, and water is the random selection.

Also, never be afraid to say stuff to the PB, just because you might change your opinion latter.

One of the reasons we try to keep our design ideas under wraps is because it creates expectation. If I were to say what we're planning, but change it, there would invariably be some who would contend that our original idea was better. Alternatively there may be some who dislike a perfectly acceptable idea and complain about that.

I'm happy to communicate with the playerbase to discuss what we're looking at, but details have to be kept in the dark until they've been solidly decided on. I hope yall understand.

You have to consider how delicate a problem balancing a race can be. I just wish beasts would get full access to cabal choice skills. As it stands a gladiator beast l

oses most of the perks for choosing glad. And only monks get a form for h2h fighting. The list is quite long for werebeast gimpage.

gimpage.

not the first word i would have chosen. being able to wear a ranger staff and have like 40 hit/dam with no gear on is far from gimped.

not the first word i would have chosen. being able to wear a ranger staff and have like 40 hit/dam with no gear on is far from gimped.

That has nothing to do with what he was talking about...

If you factor in that you lose Pugil, two handed block, and parry in return for having mediocre hit/dam I would consider that a very serious loss considering berserkers can do that, and only lose parry, not two handed, and shield block. You also lose arrows as well.

And sure it sounds impressive, but any other ranger can do the same thing minus 5 hit/dam. And they keep all their defenses + fired weapons. So to put it in perspective your really not gaining an immense amount. Any staff warrior completely steamrolls a transformed beast with very little problem. You also don't disarm worth **** transformed either.

EDIT: Also, you can't hit 40/40 naked. Its just not physically possible. In a mithril suit, with necklaces, rings and things you can get right around that with a ranger staff.

If you factor in that you lose Pugil, two handed block, and parry in return for having mediocre hit/dam I would consider that a very serious loss considering berserkers can do that, and only lose parry, not two handed, and shield block. You also lose arrows as well.

And sure it sounds impressive, but any other ranger can do the same thing minus 5 hit/dam. And they keep all their defenses + fired weapons. So to put it in perspective your really not gaining an immense amount. Any staff warrior completely steamrolls a transformed beast with very little problem. You also don't disarm worth **** transformed either.

EDIT: Also, you can't hit 40/40 naked. Its just not physically possible. In a mithril suit, with necklaces, rings and things you can get right around that with a ranger staff.

right but you're neglecting the fact that werebeats have special traits that other rangers dont have, a tiger werebeast can lag during a fight, would you ever transform vs a warrior in the first place? probably not, but its very effective against other classes. Its a tool like anything else, you have to find the right application for it. Humans dont get any bonus at all and they do just fine, a werebeast is a human that has an edge against certain classes, how does that make them gimped? and from what i remember they have an improved dodge to make up for the drop in defenses.

Werebeast warrior would be insanely powerful. The sheer number of high damage attacks (read the kadrinath vs desaram log, thats alot of damage through sanc) would be insane. Couple that with some of the werebeasts existing powers, and you could have a very very very nasty nasty warrior.

Also on the topic of werebeast zerks. Werebeast zerks are an oddity. You DO retain dodge, meaning your now the most defensive while being the most offensive. Downsides are gonna be bodyslams wont be AS effective (there are varying factors for each subrace for beast that contribute to this) The hand to hand thing really isnt a factor judging from the beasts I have seen. No roar for devastation (I would think this is balancing to keep their defenses minimal as the race was designed) cleave is useless, not too sure about headbutt. But a zerks main trouble is they rely heavily on weapon selection, losing that selection can be greatly detrimental. Although I really think a good zerk player needs to do a specific sub race as a zerk.

isn't this you singing the praises of how strong a werebeast warrior could be? I'm a little confused as to what your actual stance is on werebeasts at this point.

Humans actually do have some bonuses, such as increased duration of many magical effects and a lower exp penalty.

Also, werebeasts can accidentally transform during a fight IIRC, like like zerks can accidentally rage. I'm sure it really sucks when you're doing fine against a raging zerk with your staff/pugil, then he gets a good hit in and you autotransform and lose two-thirds of your melee defenses.

I tiger cannot lag outside of tracker. Now lets do some math.

there are 7 glad. Skills. Of those seven a transformed beast benefits from 2.5 of them.

you dont get: wm dirts, wm disarms, a special wm attack both primary and secondary.

you do get: wm sanc, wm det invis, and half of the wm special stuff.

You gain no transform friendly skills after v except arguably the E skill which even then you only get the small portion of the skill. Not its full potential

I tiger cannot lag outside of tracker. Now lets do some math.

there are 7 glad. Skills. Of those seven a transformed beast benefits from 2.5 of them.

you dont get: wm dirts, wm disarms, a special wm attack both primary and secondary.

you do get: wm sanc, wm det invis, and half of the wm special stuff.

You gain no transform friendly skills after v except arguably the E skill which even then you only get the small portion of the skill. Not its full potential

tigers have an in-combat charge like effect...

tigers have an in-combat charge like effect...

Bears you mean, perhaps.

From what I understand the werebeasts form is not specific because it is a "gift" from the nature god/goddess. Who is to say you get to choose your "gift". Also, as far as descriptions go.. you should not be focusing your description on your beast anyhow. Your normally in your human form majority of the time. IF anything, there should be two seperate descriptions for werebeasts which should have to be approved for one to rank passed the 15th lvl. Your character has no idea which form he/she has been allowed by the god/goddess of nature until she has proved you worthy of using such ability (lvl 15). I know the pains of rolling werebeasts to specifically obtain a certain form, but IMHO I think it should remain random.

Now for some of Nameless's other points.. I agree with some. Rangers can get over 40/40 with basic lvl 20 equipment and own certain classes very, very easily with just that. Now I've never completely decked one, but I'm sure it could be quite nasty. Perhaps a few things should be looked into like the use of certain cabal skills with such race, but should be tested to the fullest before any changes (dont need anything OP or unbalanced).

This is my input.

(dont need anything OP or unbalanced).

Like mino charge? ;p

Like mino charge? ;p

lol...that's right, foxx, you show them how to beat those horses, you show 'em man!

Like mino charge? ;p

Stay on topic

Im seriously dying to know what cabal you're talking to about being unbalanced with werebeasts.....

Im seriously dying to know what cabal you're talking to about being unbalanced with werebeasts.....

Any cabal is unbalanced with werebeasts.

By unbalanced, I mean gimped.

Any cabal is unbalanced with werebeasts.

By unbalanced, I mean gimped.

I wouldnt say all cabals. Just those have intercombat skills as powers. AOE and effect cabal skills work fine.

Hi. I've returned back to the mud after being gone for a few years. Have these changes been made? I'm interested in putting together a werebeast combo, though I don't want to have to level 20 different characters to 15 just to do it.