Fighting Raids

talk to your IMM to let some non pinns in your own cabal. Pre 50 cabal warfare has always been fun.

This. +100

There seems to be a bit of conflict here. People say they want earlier admission into cabals, then in the same sentence say it should be frowned upon for these early entrants to engage in cabal business. If you're letting people into cabals early, then telling them not to be aggressive towards their rank 50 enemies until they are in range, you are really just enforcing the "Cabals are only for pinnacles" stigma in a different way - by prohibiting their ability to do cabal stuff until they're at 50 anyway.

As Anume said, people who are deliberately rank sitting will find that their progression in the eyes of their cabal Imm will be very slow. They may even be ordered to rank up. I honestly don't think there is an epidemic of level sitting going on, though. It has been mentioned earlier in this thread that people often like to train up before hitting the 50 range, this isn't really rank sitting. The majority of people are trying to get to 50 to be balanced with the rest of the pinnacles.

You can't have it both ways. You can't on one hand say "We want players being inducted to Cabals earlier", then on the other hand say "But I don't want them affecting the bottom line of my rank 50 character."

There seems to be a bit of conflict here. People say they want earlier admission into cabals' date=' then in the same sentence say it should be frowned upon for these early entrants to engage in cabal business. If you're letting people into cabals early, then telling them not to be aggressive towards their rank 50 enemies until they are in range, you are really just enforcing the "Cabals are only for pinnacles" stigma in a different way - by prohibiting their ability to do cabal stuff until they're at 50 anyway.[/quote']

None of us said this. Please re-read the thread. We said if you're getting in early, your very first priority should be: RANK RANK RANK RANK RANK.

Not: RANK SIT, GAIN CPS, GAIN NEXT CABAL RANK, REFUSE TO HUNT, SIT AROUND AND DO ARMIES, GAIN CPS, GAIN NEXT CABAL RANK, GAIN CPS, GAIN CPS, GAIN CPS, GAIN CPS, RETRIEVE, REFUSE TO HUNT. etc etc etc. (You get my point.)

You can't have it both ways. You can't on one hand say "We want players being inducted to Cabals earlier", then on the other hand say "But I don't want them affecting the bottom line of my rank 50 character."

Again, this thread has nothing to do with this.

I've noticed certain sub-50 caballed people being pretty aggressive toward cabal standards vs out-of-pk 50s. Is that frowned upon at all? If not' date=' perhaps it should be.[/quote']

it is what I am talking about here, as well as raids.

So we have three people now who have come across this in game.

still a none issue?

That's what I heard.

How about anyone carrying a cabal standard is opened up to that cabals PK range regardless of rank. Then we can have lvl 35's in cabals again. That would be awesome.

Kyzarius, your approach is not really very constructive. How about you tell us about it (prayer) instead of saying "YOU IMMS NEVER DO ANYTHING!!". And yes, I do not think this is an issue as this has been just this way for years now without any major complaints or complications.

There is really more important stuff for us to fix / change than this.

Edit: It also takes about 5 seconds to tell someone "It's time to gain a couple titles" which I have done from time to time when I noticed someone not ranking in a reasonable amount of time.

Tsk, tsk Anume!! Obviously things are an issue when they affect Kyzarius' characters! How dare you insist otherwise!?

Tsk' date=' tsk Anume!! Obviously things are an issue when they affect Kyzarius' characters! How dare you insist otherwise!? [/quote']

This issue barely effects me at all.

I do not have to have some personal gain behind my suggestions, I see an opportunity for improvement.

I pointed out an issue, offered a suggested (this the ideas and suggestions forum btw) to help fix it.

In response to being told that it isn't an issue, I pointed out others in the same thread that have had similar experiences.

Not sure how there is any harm in anything I have said at all. Maybe we should treat player suggestions like what they are, and not like some kind of attack...

I think the bottom line here is that it's not really a big enough problem to revamp the whole autoexp system; issues where there are abuse will be taken care of on a case-by-case basis, as always.

I DO think it's kind of trashy for sub-50 caballed characters to steal standards when there isn't a rival caballed character in their PK range. Perhaps that could be changed to make it where it can't be capped if someone in the opposing call who happens to be in their PK range isn't logged in. Something similar to the whole "can't cap the standard if nobody in the opposing cabal is logged in" rule.

Keep your panties on Kyz. I posted this cuz you typically DO start threads when situations affect your characters. I get it - you put a lot of time in your chars and you don't want them to have disadvantages. But, in the grand scheme of things, this particular issue is microscopic...if it's even an issue at all. Like others have said, use the bounty system?

And, in response to stealing standards pre-50. Who cares? Get it back! Great way to gain CP if you ask me! Typically, only cabals whose numbers are lacking will recruit pre-50 anyway and like Anume said, if they stay there for a long time, they will get blasted. These responses are more or less in line with the full-looting threads. One person gets full-looted and suddenly it's an epidemic...EVERYONE IS FULL-LOOTING WTF!! When in reality, that is not the case. A few people got upset because it happened to them and next thing you know, it's a pandemic.

Also bear in mind that a lot of training tends to be done in the 40-41 range' date=' which could easily account for plenty of hours.[/quote']

If you aint trained then shouldnt get into a cabal imo..

You shouldnt get into a cabal with the intention of stopping and training. If you haven o intention on training, then fine.

Why does it matter period.

If he wants to sit forever as a level 35 let him, it does not matter. It won't affect you. if you lose your standard (unlikely) Go get it, get some free cp, and yay your back to normal +30 cp.

Seriously, why does it matter? Not like he is gonna get T, E or L sitting at X rank forever.

If you aint trained then shouldnt get into a cabal imo..

You shouldnt get into a cabal with the intention of stopping and training. If you haven o intention on training, then fine.

Again, if a person is doing far too much of this, then that's a matter for the cabal imm to handle - but I think it'd be incredibly counter-productive to say that once you are caballed, if you aren't 50, all you should be doing is ranking. The game does not begin at 50 - not even the caballed game.

Seriously, it is so incredibly rare that we have someone caballed pre-50 AND spending enough time pre-50 after being caballed that anyone has any problem with it - this kind of thing is handled just fine on a case by case basis by the IMMs. We don't need a rules change for it.

"If you aint trained then shouldnt get into a cabal imo.."

I disagree, there is no problem with being untrained in a cabal. Or training while cabaled.

The only problem that exists is skiping cabal duties to train.

Cabal duties such as:

Defending your standard.

Failing that, retrieving your standard.

I understand that people skip taking standard and armies warfare. Or hunting opposing cabal members. This are things primarily linked to your own character options.

But failing to provide a challenge when enemy cabal comes calling, is unfitting.

Not that they should die for the standard, but an attempt should be made. If they send you packing, fill free to resume training. The other cabal had his chance and could not capitalize on it. If they really want your head they should get up from their fat asses and go track you.

Being cabaled is not an excuse to demand people to fight you non stop. You want a kill, you go work for it.

On the raids. I do not see what the problem is?

Having played a Tribunal in the past, I can say that raids benefit more Watchers/Syndicate than the Tribunal.

• For once, the Tribunal cannot raid.

• Second, a Tribunal cannot fight the raid and the PC at the same time. If you can, most cannot. And no weak Watcher/Syndicate will initiate a raid if they know they will lose.

• While the Tribunal is fighting the Watcher/Sindicate and not fighting the Raid he is losing % of his Standard.

The only hope for the Tribunal is that some low level hunting party decides to hunt the Raiders for their huge xp bonus. But a smart Watcher/Syndicate will not raid if he senses that chance.

Frankly I could not care less for Raids and Standards, for I do not make my characters dependent of cabal skills.

But I get frustrated when people complain that lowlevels they can't PK ruin their Raids. That is the reason raids exist. To enhance the FL gaming experience of the Sub 50.

Any 50 will be to busy trying to kill the Watcher/Sindicate to fight the raid. Raid do not exist to give CP bonus to Watcher/Sindicate, that is just the carrot to make raids happen.

I personally do not see a problem with the raid system as is. The Imms tend to take quick notice if someone is not ranking up for a reason. If they are not training, then that is pretty much what they should be doing, if caballed.

I definitely disagree that if you are in a cabal, you should not be training and making sure you are getting to 50. When you get that message you can apply for a cabal, you want to take advantage of that window of opportunity.

I myself have been in the situation where I was caballed early, I was training, but because my playing time dropped a bit, it was going slow and I was told to hurry it up or lose my spot. This was quite fair because I agree sitting and gaining cabal rank should definitely be a no-no, however, it will certainly not get you to T. At lvl 50, you can do the same thing, by only trying to log on when your enemies are not, obviously this is hit or miss, but the point stands.

Would it not fix the situation to simply not allow autopromotion to cabaled individuals who have yet to reach 50?

Would it not fix the situation to simply not allow autopromotion to cabaled individuals who have yet to reach 50?

That might not be a bad idea... but I am not sure we should really penalize people like that. I think the system is fine as is, if someone is abusing the system, the Imms are more than capable of making sure the proper penalty is dolled out.

My concern is for those that have worked hard and earned their spot within the cabal, and have no intention of abusing that position. There is no reason to penalize them. It is not as if they are going to reach T anyways before they hit 50.