Zrothum my man, what do you suggest? Lets talk in figures, I am curious to see.
Lets say I play a decked to the teeth character who is an E. How much hours monthly do you want from me to allow me to keep my cabal rank/rares? Just theoretically.
Locked Rare Purge Time Limit
If you've decided to take on the responsibility of an Elder cabaled character and/or take up the best suit of rares/uniques in the world than I personally would like to see you play about 5 hours a week. Not a monthly limit, a weekly limit.
Is this technically a "Game" ? Yes. However it is a very competitive game and inside this game is a real world with real characters. The game has mechanics that do not offer the same level of reward to everyone. Certain people with certain skill level/time allowances can excel far pass some people. This creates an environment and a game that is on longer JUST a game. The actions you do affect the world. In my opinion you have a responsibility when you play this game as a cabaled Elder or a very skilled player with great gear. It isn't your playground just to come and look amazing to everyone. Do the game a favor and be present. Lead by example. This game is meant to be played a certain way. In my opinion if you can't play it, then don't.
You may have an elder, but an elder must be example to everyone of the cabal.What example do you give?
Glad you're the authority now 
I'm not. I was answering a question that someone asked me. I've never once come here and said "These players need to play x amount of hours because I said so." What I have done is taken on a situation that many people have complained about, not only to me and others, but to the staff as well. I've attempted to analyze it from all angles and offer what I think would be a fair resolution. I've also helped to develop other people's ideas as well. I've never said anyone is right or wrong here. I've made sure to reiterate numerous that these are only my opinions...so I'm sorry you took things the wrong way, did not read my posts thoroughly, and feel as though I'm attempting to be the authority on the matter.
I'm glad to see you've taken this personally and finally commented though 
I've never once come here and said "These players need to play x amount of hours because I said so."
Yes you have. You called me out personally. Don't be so quick to forget your words, because I surely haven't my friend. From Phamane's deletion thread...
MF...u are Grum? Man' date=' put those shinies back in circulation lol [/quote']
I consider this whole thread a personal assault until you say otherwise.
I personally would like to see you play about 5 hours a week. Not a monthly limit' date=' a weekly limit.[/quote']
That sounds fair. What happens if I decide to go to on vocation though? A weekly vocation should lose me something for which I've worked half an year? We might as well actually put a daily time limit - 1 hour/day - hey you haven't logged today, you're out of the cabal! And yeah, I don't care what you did in the cabal for the past year, YOU DIDN'T LOG IN TODAY, OUT WITH YOU!
shrug
You may have an elder' date=' but an elder must be example to everyone of the cabal.What example do you give?[/quote']
An example is given when you take the respononsibility for which you are in cabal i.e when you fight your cabal enemies and when you follow the goals of your cabals. Not when you sit 5 hours a day staring at a monotor, playing a character noone wants to fight. If that is what you want alright, but those elder WILL keep their suit. And it the end not only you will be whining again, but the people who are getting killed/full looted by the same elders which you forced to spend more time in the game.
You make those elders spend more time inside the game and you can ASSURE you, we will lose players with an incredible speed. And not just the people who get killed by those elder but the people who play them too, since they will get bored FAST.
I am with Mindflayer on this one. You make that elder. You be the example. It is always easy to speak from the observer's point of view.
I don't forget the things I say and I stand behind them completely.
This entire thread has not been a personal assault on you.
Have you and other characters been in mind while I wrote it and reviewed time stamps on some things? Yes. However, this has never been anything personal between me and you, nor has it solely been about you/Grum. You aren't the only decked person or decked Elder who this thread has been referencing.
That sounds fair. What happens if I decide to go to on vocation though? A weekly vocation should lose me something for which I've worked half an year?
Of course not. With a major mechanic overhaul like this, certain allowances would have to be made.
The good thing is that you probably won't be going on vacation every month. So exceptions would rarely have to be made. Just like people who are expecting to be gone for awhile normally post something on prayer or note their cabal IMM, the same could be done in this event, allowing a forced hour update or something to the pfile.
I highly doubt this would occur very often so the nuisance would be minimal. It's excessive requests that would be a red flag. And I realize it is a bit of a catch-22. Does the game's players need to suffer because you don't have time to play? Should you be punished just because you got busy?
At the end of the day you have to do what is best for the game, since that is the focal point of everything here.
And I do not think forcing these people to play will lose characters. NOT if they take on the responsiblity of being a mature player. They don't have to go around full looting everyone or multikilling everyone. They don't have to sit there and stare at their screen for 5 hours. They CAN find productive things to do, they just choose not to. They can positively enhance this game with their presence if they choose to do so. It may not be the most fun thing in the world after you annihilate a cabal and have no enemies for awhile. But there ARE more things to this game than just PK (as I am learning )
I am leading by example if you want my opinion. I don't full loot the countless people I kill. I RP like crazy. I stay on when only 4 ppl are on...me and 3 lowbies. I fight anyone my RP instructs that I fight. I lose my awesome gear, I get it back. I have ONE alt and I barely play him. It is boring and it sucks...but that is the game sometimes. Should I just stay off and keep all the gear I have out of the game for these up and comers or for people who aren't in my time zone? No, I should either suffer thruogh the lows and enjoy the highs...or I should cabal quit and sac all. I'm not saying I'm perfect or that everyone should be like me...but what I am trying to point out is that you CAN do it.
You aren't the only decked person or decked Elder who this thread has been referencing.
Thank you. It sure felt like it.
Thank you. It sure felt like it.
If you want brutal honesty from me...it would be that you are one of the more prominent people on my mind regarding this thread. But that's mostly because you were a big factor in my character's starting stages, helped with a portion of his RP plot, if it could be called such...and then disappeared and the plot fell through because of it. I tried to carry it on but the only response I got was "Grum will handle that." "That's Grum's department."
Yeah well guess what? I haven't seen that dude in weeks.
That, piled on top of the rare issue, put you in the top3 heavyweight contenders for the rare hoarding championship belt 
I am leading by example if you want my opinion. I don't full loot. I RP like crazy. I stay on when only 4 ppl are on...me and 3 lowbies. I fight anyone my RP instructs that I fight. I lose my awesome gear' date=' I get it back. I have ONE alt and I barely play him. It is boring and it sucks...but that is the game sometimes. Should I just stay off and keep all the gear I have out of the game for these up and comers or for people who aren't in my time zone? No, I should either suffer thruogh the lows and enjoy the highs...or I should cabal quit and sac all.[/quote']
Not everyone is you mate. Some people feel tired after work, sometimes they don't feel like logging on that elder. Sometimes real life stuff affects the decisions of their characters so they prefer to stay off. Sometimes they can't dedicate 100% of their attention to the mud so they log in with their lowbie which they don't care that much about. I can go on and on and on. You are looking at things only from one side. Do you really see an active elder at this moment? EACH single elder at the moment is not completely active. From Grum, through Oppressant, Thulgan, Sartach, Sepahoona to Istendil. I am certain each of the players who plays one of those characters has an alt and spends more time on it than on his elder.
Currently you spend what? ~10 hours a day playing? Then there is the_nightmare, who currently spends about ~6 hours a day playing. I would suggest you to stick to your characters for 5-6 more months and we will see if you will be able to dedicate that much to them. Z-man, your current pinn is like 3-4 weeks old and you already have an alt. That should hint you towards something.
After all this is just a game which most of us has picked to play because we can do well at it without the need to be active. You put an activity requirement and I can guarantee you that you will lose a lot of people. Especially a requirement that goes on weekly basis.
Also, when we've had characters that have lasted for an year or two, don't you think that 1 week is a bit too little time to decide whether someone deserves something? Be it EQ, cabal rank or Qthing?
I'm not looking at things from only one side. As I've said, I can make an argument for both ends of things. However, ONE of those arguments does something good for the MUD. The other does something good for specific players.
As I've said, i don't expect everyone to play the type of hours I do. It's a personal choice I make to play this much.
There are reasons this character is not 3 months old. I never personally gave up on any of the character I've made in the past 3 months.
You are losing people already, due to the issue being discussed here. It has yet to be seen whether or not people will leave because of rare purge increases.
And if they are leaving because they can't keep all that super eq...then they are playing for the wrong reason anyway.
If you want brutal honesty from me...it would be that you are one of the more prominent people on my mind regarding this thread. But that's mostly because you were a big factor in my character's starting stages, helped with a portion of his RP plot, if it could be called such...and then disappeared and the plot fell through because of it. I tried to carry it on but the only response I got was "Grum will handle that." "That's Grum's department."
Yeah well guess what? I haven't seen that dude in weeks.
You can always send me a PM and we can arrange a time to flesh out some RP in game.
Use OOC resources to schedule a meeting with a decked cabal elder whom I normally would not see in game? (ironic coming from me, I know.)
I could do that...but should I have to?
Just food for thought, not really trying to be a dick or attack you. Just emphasizing my point.
Zrothum my man, what do you suggest? Lets talk in figures, I am curious to see.
Lets say I play a decked to the teeth character who is an E. How much hours monthly do you want from me to allow me to keep my cabal rank/rares? Just theoretically.
There is already a way that an Immortal can set your character to not be rare purged, regardless of hours. So, a system for this is already in place. And it's all about minutes, not hours
And if they are leaving because they can't keep all that super eq...then they are playing for the wrong reason anyway.
Mate, you keep talking about that super EQ. It is not the super EQ that bothers me, but the whole logic of yours. You want to take away something for which someone has worked for months in a matter of weeks. That is not how you do things in FL.
And no we are not losing players. Actually things were much better now than they were a year ago.
You're wrong there, foxx. I don't want to take away anything from anyone. I just want to devise a system that requires people who earned those things to also earn the right to keep them.
Again I've never said anyone is bad for not playing their characters with all those rares. I can certainly understand the concept that playing at 50 with no one to PK against is boring. I face that almost every day.
However that is not anyone's fault, that is just the game you've decided to play.
And yes I do have an alt Foxx...but it's not because I'm bored. It is because there are many things in this game I want to try. The time I spent on my main is much, much more than it is my alt. My alt also carries zero rares.
The reason I play alts is for a change of pace. A neutral lawful stone giant, can't exactly go on a PK'ing spree. Sometimes I just want to log on an uncaballed alt (and I have a few-all decked in rares by the way ) to have some fun and be someone else. The character I play, or more the roleplay, is dedicated by the mood that I'm in. Usually I'm an evil bastard that wants to take out my aggression on some hapless elf. So sue me! 
Sometimes is one thing, but when was the last time you've logged onto Grum before today?
I'm not on for 24 hours at a time, but I play an awful lot. Last time I saw Grum was 3 weeks ago. Seen the only alt of yours that I know much more than that.
I hate to start debating about one character though because it will take away from my true position on the argument which is not about just you or Grum or what you do in the game.
I am all for having alts IF you can still contribute to the world with your main on the level that a cabal elder should be expected to. If you can't, then it's my opinion you should let him go.
Anywayyyy. I've said about everything I can on this topic and I feel it starting to go in a direction that will only end up with some personal quarrel with me and Mindflayer. I've got no hard feelings towards Mindflayer and would rather there not be any created over something I originally intended to just be brainstorming on ideas of ways to reconstruct what is otherwise a very simple rare purge code. (30 minutes a day IS very close to what it actually is)
So with that, I bid this topic adieu
(rare purge time limits based on aggregate item lvl for the win calculated by weekly minutes instead of monthly minutes)