Assassinate

Zhorkil is entirely right to lock the thread in general - as it was sourced from an in game event (someone dying) and was populated with very biased views from people from both sides.

However I Still feel this area deserves consideration.

As someone who has played 3 Ninjas at 50 - one of them falcon eye, i don't actually think study, or meditating upon study requires a change. I expect to be challenged on that.

The one thing I have disliked about this skill over the last 9 (or is it 10 now?) yeasrs I have been involved with this game is the fact that is has no counter - unless you are playing a class that can detect hidden.

The traditional counter was always to poison yourself, so you couldn't be strangled - however that has not been an effective counter for years - since people figured out how important Hit roll is in, and how easy it is to assassinate someone who is poisoned if you have high hit roll.

I would propose one - and only one change to this skill, that it be impossible to assassinate someone who is awake (with some special dispensation included for certain qclasses that can't be strangled.) This means that a ninja has to actually suprise someone, rather than just gather study and then sit in a room spammming the skill until that person walks in.

rofl

really now?

An assassination is OP thread.

I think its perfect the way it is, there are so many ways to bring ninjas out of the shadows- gosh, and ways to prevent them from going in them.

And personally, I believe spamming assassinate is the worst idea a ninja could ever think of.

It's been gimped to hell since last you played.

It's fine now. And that's a lot coming from me.

Brehan edit Yeah I am done.

Yes Brehan, we've heard of the "I've played for so and so many years and I've never had a character been assassinated" type of reasoning. Does that mean the skills is alright though or it simply means you haven't met a skilled enough ninja?

There have been a few that have hugely abused the assassinate skill, including Tassin's last ninja, Skia, Phamane... need I mention more?

When player gets assassinated and brings attention to the skill, he gets accused he is angry and needs to think about balance and "rare circulation".

When he brings the subject of assassinate without being assassinated recently, he gets asked why does he want something changed without any proof that it is broken, i.e. you haven't been assassinated recently, so why do you want to change it?

The biggest argument in defense of the assassinate skill is that it helps rare circulation. Please... If you want to help rare circulation one would remove life insurance and then would create strict rules against ganging/tagging.

Currently, a character can be studied and assassinated in less than 6-7 ticks. Once you are fully studied, there is NOTHING you can do to prevent being assassinated. I've been assassinated with a ninja that has 103 in all defenses, that had detect hidden on, that was blessed, armor, shielded, hasted, poisoned, with sanctuary on, that was much better dressed that the other ninja.

So please, please to tell me how is that skill balanced?

There is some myth that if you stand in an area where ninja can't hide you won't get studied. That is of course, a complete nonsense. The ninja comes to you, runs around you for a tick, then goes back to hiding and meditates a few times. Repeat two more times and you have a full study. Then you just have to spam assassinate.

You are wrong f0xx, I actually have studied and assassinated people in three ticks.You just need to have the proper equipment and race/nijitsu.Actually I like assassinate and I have mentioned before skilled thief with the proper combo can kill you only with backstab.Backstab is better than assassinate, there is no risk at all.You just wait your victim to hit that antimagic trap and with the proper damroll and weapons you can kill him in one backstab+throw combo.Backstab is more potent one hit kill that any assassinate.So please stop arguing and just play the game, plus assassinate is super gimped right now.

Foxx... you are exaggerating a bit. The chances are incredibly low of getting enough of a study in just three ticks of observation and then another three of meditation. That's not even a complete study session. It may happen, it may give you enough of a chance that an assassination is possible and you may get the lucky roll of the dice... but you make it sound like it happens all the time, and my experience shows that to be not at all true.

And yes, sitting somewhere and not moving will not prevent a ninja from assassinating you. Please name one person who has ever said it would.

Honestly, I'm of the exact opposite opinion regarding ninjas and assassinate - I'd prefer to see them become even more stealth and assassinate oriented, and to lose enough of a portion of their melee strength so that pretty much anything engaging them in the open has a power advantage.

I never mentioned that it has happened anytime, I have been lucky but yes it has happened.I agree with you here, ninjas rely on one assassinate and nothing else.Ninjas are very gimped especially with the change of caltraps, not to mention lotus scourge ninjas, they are the biggest joke of FL history(hands down for Kaylia who has managed to own pretty much of the pbase with this gimped ninjitsu).I agree with you, I would love to see ninjas more stealth oriented because this is exactly how a ninja should be.

My post wasn't at all in response to yours, nightmare - yours went up while I was typing up mine, and I hadn't seen it.

Personally, it takes alot more skill to assassinate someone, than to bashlock them to death.

And I have never gotten a full study off of just 3 ticks. Just sayin.

Since when you need full study to assassinate someone?

When you dont want to take any chances, and when most of the people you go after cant be strangled, or refuse to be for that matter-

I've been playing ninja (straight) for over a year now- I have a good idea what im talking about.

skill? what skill is there in studying someone who is fighitng someone else...then when they rest from fighting assasinating.

comeon, I want to see someone support that.

Every assasinate I have been a victim of for the past several months has gone down just like that. I am fighting cabal warfare, or am locked in a very close fight with an enemy and get assasinated.

Brehan, so what do you do in cabal warfare? A ninja is online so you quit? Because that is the only way to avoid getting killed other than hiding in some closed off room (and losing your standard).

The problem is that you can be studied while your in combat with someone else. Normally if people want to double team you, they have to fight you trying to get your hp to 0. Study is the variable, it lets them "fight you" by just watching you, then all that accumulated "fight" is unloaded at once in the assasinate. One example is how some recent pk's went down (no not involving me at all) where one player is fighting another, the second however knows his ninja buddy is around so he just leads the first player around, fighiting only some then fleeing, so his buddy can study and assasinate.

The origional thread wasnt meant to be whining, it was just a comment on the audacity of dieing in such a manner. I also knew it would get some replies form other people I know feel the same way.

And yes, sitting somewhere and not moving will not prevent a ninja from assassinating you. Please name one person who has ever said it would.

Brehan made a small hint towards not going in areas which they can hide in, that is why I made that comment. It doesn't really matter whether they can hide or not in the area you are in.

Honestly' date=' I'm of the exact opposite opinion regarding ninjas and assassinate - I'd prefer to see them become even more stealth and assassinate oriented, and to lose enough of a portion of their melee strength so that pretty much anything engaging them in the open has a power advantage.[/quote']

That is what I mean as well.

An assassinate ninja is supposed to be a stealth assassin. Not one that runs around you, with you being fully aware that you are being studied. How do you assassinate someone, who knows you are coming to assassinate him and will use the "weak" spots in your body. I mean, an assassin that is not stealthy is simply not an assassin and therefore shouldn't benefit the abilities of an assassin i.e. landing an assassinate. I agree with changing assassinate to work only on sleeping targets. I would agree if it also does something like 50% of your total HP in damage if you are not asleep.

Actually I like assassinate and I have mentioned before skilled thief with the proper combo can kill you only with backstab.

While I generally agree with your statement, being backstabbed can be countered by numerous tactics. First of all, if you use backstab on targets that are awake and have counter you WILL be countered, which does not go for assassinate. Secondly, you mentioned being dispelled and there are ways to fight being dispelled i.e. saves. Thirdly, if you do manage to put a mage to sleep, and backstab him, he can just recall without having to walk in your traps and suck damage from autothrow.

You don't understand why backstab is OK and assassinate is not - backstab can be countered and it can be countered by many ways.

Now, please tell me, how can assassinate be countered? By logging out?

Life in Fl is not supposed to be easy.

Ninja ninja!

Life in Fl is not supposed to be easy.

Ninja ninja!

LOL Atticus, thats a great argument you got there! Hahahha

LOL Atticus' date=' thats a great argument you got there! Hahahha[/quote']

you dont really want to get me started do youuuu?

<3 foxxxx

backstab is not better than assasinate.

antimagic is subject to mental saves

and you can drop you hp, effectively negating the backstab skill.

I remember some time ago, Istendil was fighting two characters and Tassin's recent assassinate ninja was running around studying him. Me being an evil thief, I was able to see the ninja.

Jibber being the idiotic brave heart he usually is, didn't give up, so I simply followed the battle. Eventually they moved to the elf valley where he got assassinated, naturally. His equipment was gone is milliseconds and I manged to grab a piece or two.

He was back fast, but with three characters standing on top of his (used to be) decked corpse, you can guess how much was left. I felt really bad for the sh!tty way he died, and due to his bravery I returned the two pieces I grabbed from his corpse with my lowbie thief. Which two seconds after that lead me to sitting in deep **** having a nice talk with Anume, explaining why an evil character gives EQ to a knight leader

Anyway, gotta love the assassinate skill.

Btw, I still haven't seen ONE sensible proof in support of the assassinate skill and why does it have to work the way it works.

PS. Congrats to Atticus who has finally found a way to kill someone