Archery Rangers

To fix some issues we have now: Missile immunity scroll only block 25% of the damage from archer arrows, classes with fired weapons may only fire back if they're in their own range and are not reloading.

Besides the above I believe this path could be given some more versatility.  As the only range focused combat class there are a lot of options we could choose from.  I thought of a couple at work today and even if they aren't good maybe they'll inspire someone to comment with a better idea.  NOTE: In the 2011 change log it says "Artificer perk will correctly give a bonus to bowyer now."  It does not give a bonus still.

Bowyer changes:

While we're able to created different types of fired weapons why not do two changes, we can do the following:

1. Give a skill based on the type of weapon used.  An idea for this would be firing 3 arrows at once from a bow into the target.  The downside being you would then take longer to reload than if you'd waited and fired those three in combat normally.  Basically it would be a finisher or to cause them to flee.  Another could be to use a sling which can hit them in the head sometimes and cause dizzyness.

2. Give archers the ability to customize the weapon sort of like what bards do.  You could choose spread (aoe), sniper (slow shots with more damage and extended range), rapid fire (less damage but even faster shooting), double shot (two shots at once, twice the reload time).  These are just a few that come to mind.

Fletcher changes:

Only two arrows can be 100% depended on that you can normally make, 3 if you get over 100%

Would it be OP to create arrows that wound the target for bleeding, flash brightly to blind, blunt shots to knock their brain silly like thunderclap, paralyze to slow them down or something more like this?  I'm thinking more of archers as a ranged shaman I suppose.  They wound the target to prevent them from escaping and then wear them down while dancing around them.

If these changes are too extreme to lower the power of the path we could remove beast call I suppose.  This way the enemy if they catch them would have the advantage in an up close fight.  Of course if they want to be safe they could just hide behind a door I suppose.

Nice ideas though some of it is already in the game.  

You already can make bleed arrows I believe, fireblind, poison, plague, and sleep.  At least that I know of.  Haven't played an archer in years.

Maybe it's the low chance of effect but I tried many of them and they did nothing.  Usually I ended up using fire, ice and one physical.  wish there was a dummy somewhere in game you could set up in 3 modes easy, neutral, hard for different -ac with infinite hp that could take effects for me to practice on.  Could see how many shots landed an effect and get the chance of it happening.  Could also test damage output with different hit/dam.

Aren't some of them blatantly named? Disease arrow? Poison arrow?  I think frog arrow is bleed.

Poison and disease yes, I don't use disease much because my swarm gives disease and in some situations I don't want it spreading back to me.  Poison is good but tbh I rarely see it land the effect.  I realize some of these effects exist but I'm wanting to make them more reliable than they are now.  Make it based of the ranger's level vs the saves of the enemy if it isn't now.  If it is it needs to be increased IMO.  Oh and I never used frog arrows, bet they're awesome if you want to Kermit murder.

Archery path does not need buffing - jesus.  Learn some tactics, get better gear, i don't know but please do not buff archer rangers.  I swear you people have one fight that doesn't go your way and suddenly your class is underpowered.  Learn to adapt!!

8 minutes ago, Mmm Beer said:

Archery path does not teen buffing - jesus.

The path does need something added to it, no other path in the game is as easily weakened.  Just pre-teen you're in the shoes of the people who've tried it lately and found it to be extremely lacking.  I'm not wanting to make it the strongest path but I'd like for the three to be balanced so that you don't feel cheated by taking one.

-That's two in a row, I'll be here all night folks!

Edit: If you fix you're mistakes then it's not as fun! :(

for some reason I recall darts working better for poison and plague, while arrows work better for frog.  While the blunt one for crossbows...

I could just be making this shit up too, lol.

The problem with making arrow effects more reliable is balance - no class in the game other than archer rangers can repeatedly attempt to land mals at a distance.  Shamans can voodoo, but attempts come with a hefty cool down - an archer can peg you with arrow after arrow.  In every other case, to mal someone you have to be in the same room with them - and this usually means you're in combat with the opponent and that they are capable of hurting you back.  Archers are also the only class that can innately land multiple mals without inputting a command and lagging themselves (ninja/thief auto throw on flee is the only similar case, and that's limited to poison) - your plague arrows autofire as rounds go by, but even a shaman has to commune the spell.  I think you are underestimating how much of a benefit it is to be able to dirt or cast thunderstorms at the same time as you are dropping mals on the target.

The nice thing about archer rangers is that you force people to counter your arrows which often leads them open to your melee/pets. Not an easy choice for something like a blm. You lose some straight melee/finishing oomphf and instead gain some tactical options. While I think that rangers need balancing compared to other classes, the paths compared internally to themselves are pretty good.

Quote

As the only range focused combat class

This is where the problem comes  from. You keep saying they are a "range focused class'. They are not. If they were, they wouldn't have beasts, defenses, weapons. You are supposed to "poke" your opponent with arrows. Not kill him. All of the advantages of the archer path work in melee combat too, and on top of that, people are forced to buy very expensive scrolls, which last for a very short time, in order to block some of your arrows.

Archers are also the most versatile of the paths. In comparison, beastmasters get their beasts killed, and then what? Trackers' thrown objects are blocked by certain abilities, track itself is a bit useless if the victim knows what its doing.

Perhaps you need to listen to Mmm beer's advice, and try to improve your tactics, rather than blame the class.

Maybe I should roll an archer next, haha

Maybe the thing archers are lacking is paralysis arrows. Everyone can easily gain it nowadays...why wouldn't master fletcher be able to create em, hrm?

It's likely that I'm just not creative, but for all the great things about archery and fletchery... bowyer just feels like a disappointment.

If I'm wrong about bowyer, please enlighten me.  I feel the ability to keep constantly stocked and to produce the type of ammo you need to be too good to pass up.

2 hours ago, kamikazi said:

Maybe the thing archers are lacking is paralysis arrows. Everyone can easily gain it nowadays...why wouldn't master fletcher be able to create em, hrm?

Um no.

Archers are already able to hit almost any vuln. Fire, ice, vorpal (glow), Exploding (group damage), magic (high magic offense), Sharp (bleed), Shocking... etc I'm not going to go into them all. The options are already huge.

Also couple that with bowyer - which I am sure you haven't experimented fully with but each different style of weapon has a different advantage and disadvantage. Some will allow you to land the 'effects' of your ammunition much easier then others. Some will cause more damage. Etc....

I don't think we've had a bowyer who has experimented with archery properly since Corinkorth days. Who thinks he was weak? Or other archer rangers of memory? (Senrail anyone?)

Senrail was a beastmaster...

Fine. Semantics. Out of my whole post concentrate on literally the last 2 words.

 We have had lots of strong archers. If someone wants to read the post and understand the advice in there, power to them ;)

The only sub-succsessful archer has been the ogre you mentioned and that was pre arrow nerf. In my opinion archers ARE lacking something and I've brought it up before. I met the same feedback as now though...They are strong...That's why we don't see anyone playing them, right? Cause they are strong, ahahah

I was just sayin the right thing. Senrail is not a good example as he wasn't from the said path. I did not say anything about the rest of your post, cause I haven't tried the different weapon types myself, so I do not know about that. I haven't tried them, dew to the fact they were crumbling all the time while in battle, thus making them useless. And their damage and accuracy is nothing compared to the bone bow, or composite bow, or consecrated bow, or knotted bow, or ANY other rare bow/crossbow out there, and the weapons a BOWYER is creating are supposed to be SPECIAL, since its one of the archers SIGNATURE skills. Compare them to the instruments EVERY bardic path is able to make and you would get my point. Bowyer skill sucks hard.

Also...I have tested an archer, without rapid fire, with archery skill and marksman skill shooting at a warrior of same hit/dam roll five rooms away...Not only he was able to fire back everytime, but the damage he was dealing without mentioned skills that are supposed to up your fired weapons damage was TREMENDOUSLY higher. Funny, innit? I've played 10 archers and from all the testing, I've gathered they are only good to easily gather equipment. Not as good anymore even, dew to the fact some creatures got HARDENED and you are no longer able to shoot them, which should be bypassed by an archer if you ask me. Just my two cents. As it is, no matter what everybody says, the ARCHER path is the weakest in PVP. Trust me...I know. I've played hundreds of rangers.